The Good, Bad and Ugly of Neal Brown

[WVUALLEN]

The Good: Brown took over a Troy team that went 3-9 the year before his arrival (2014). His team went 4-8 his first year but went 31-8 the next three years he was at Troy. Although he is considered an offensive guru because of his background as an offensive coordinator, his teams shined defensively while at Troy. New defensive coordinator Vic Koenning’s defensive squads are consistently among the nation’s top teams in takeaways. The Trojans ranked third nationally last year, forcing 31 turnovers. They were ranked 16th and fourth in the previous two seasons.

In addition, he has brought a sense of optimism and enthusiasm to the program not seen during the Dana Holgorsen era. He is a family man and the players seem to really like him so far. He will always say the right thing and make decisions based on his principles. Neal Brown is not someone that we have to worry about getting drunk and thrown out of a casino or having an affair with his secretary. He’s wholesome and he’s young and he’s talented. He’s a very good, safe hire for West Virginia.

The Bad: Troy played one team last year ranked in the Top 25 and they were defeated badly, losing 56-20 to the then 22nd-ranked Boise State team at home. They did beat Nebraska in Lincoln early in the season, but Nebraska at the beginning of the season was one of the worst teams in the nation. Troy also lost to Liberty and Appalachian State last year. During the 2017-2018 season, they averaged 30.7 points per game, which was 51st out of 130 Division I teams.

It is unlikely that Neal Brown is fully equipped to handle the pressures and challenges of the Big 12 in his first season. He will be doing a lot of on-the-job training during his first season with the Mountaineers and that will lead to growing pains. Early season out of conference games against Missouri and N.C. State could be brutal before the always tremendously-difficult Big 12 Conference schedule.

The Ugly: Neal Brown has no ties to West Virginia. This hire feels an awful lot like the John Beilein hiring in basketball back in 2002. Both were very respected, talented coaches that moved around quite a bit before settling at West Virginia. Neither had any previous connection whatsoever to West Virginia before being hired. If (when) Neal Brown is hugely successful at WVU, what will keep him here? Brown, following a few years of great success as the Mountaineer Head Coach, will be courted by every big-time university in the country with a coaching vacancy.

This doesn’t feel like a long-term solution. Neal Brown is the anti-Dana Holgorsen and an outstanding bridge coach to the program’s future, but to expect Brown to have any real loyalty to the program is naive. We don’t like to think of WVU as a stepping stone job, but its recent history suggests that it is.

Another major concern with Brown is recruiting. He will quickly find (if he hasn’t already) that recruiting players to WVU that can compete in the Big 12 will be a lot harder than he’s used to doing and it will be even harder because he’s recruiting them to Morgantown. He’s made it clear that he wants to focus on keeping in-state talent, but you’re not going to win many games in the Big 12 with West Virginia high school talent. The challenge of getting elite talent to Morgantown has proven to be extremely challenging in the past and it won’t get any easier with a Head Coach that will be a fish out of water during his first few years.

https://mountaineersports.com/neal-brown-isnt-perfect-or-the-good-bad-and-ugly-of-neal-brown/

 

[WVex-pat in GA]

The Good: Brown took over a Troy team that went 3-9 the year before his arrival (2014). His team went 4-8 his first year but went 31-8 the next three years he was at Troy. Although he is considered an offensive guru because of his background as an offensive coordinator, his teams shined defensively while at Troy. New defensive coordinator Vic Koenning’s defensive squads are consistently among the nation’s top teams in takeaways. The Trojans ranked third nationally last year, forcing 31 turnovers. They were ranked 16th and fourth in the previous two seasons.

In addition, he has brought a sense of optimism and enthusiasm to the program not seen during the Dana Holgorsen era. He is a family man and the players seem to really like him so far. He will always say the right thing and make decisions based on his principles. Neal Brown is not someone that we have to worry about getting drunk and thrown out of a casino or having an affair with his secretary. He’s wholesome and he’s young and he’s talented. He’s a very good, safe hire for West Virginia.

The Bad: Troy played one team last year ranked in the Top 25 and they were defeated badly, losing 56-20 to the then 22nd-ranked Boise State team at home. They did beat Nebraska in Lincoln early in the season, but Nebraska at the beginning of the season was one of the worst teams in the nation. Troy also lost to Liberty and Appalachian State last year. During the 2017-2018 season, they averaged 30.7 points per game, which was 51st out of 130 Division I teams.

It is unlikely that Neal Brown is fully equipped to handle the pressures and challenges of the Big 12 in his first season. He will be doing a lot of on-the-job training during his first season with the Mountaineers and that will lead to growing pains. Early season out of conference games against Missouri and N.C. State could be brutal before the always tremendously-difficult Big 12 Conference schedule.

The Ugly: Neal Brown has no ties to West Virginia. This hire feels an awful lot like the John Beilein hiring in basketball back in 2002. Both were very respected, talented coaches that moved around quite a bit before settling at West Virginia. Neither had any previous connection whatsoever to West Virginia before being hired. If (when) Neal Brown is hugely successful at WVU, what will keep him here? Brown, following a few years of great success as the Mountaineer Head Coach, will be courted by every big-time university in the country with a coaching vacancy.

This doesn’t feel like a long-term solution. Neal Brown is the anti-Dana Holgorsen and an outstanding bridge coach to the program’s future, but to expect Brown to have any real loyalty to the program is naive. We don’t like to think of WVU as a stepping stone job, but its recent history suggests that it is.

Another major concern with Brown is recruiting. He will quickly find (if he hasn’t already) that recruiting players to WVU that can compete in the Big 12 will be a lot harder than he’s used to doing and it will be even harder because he’s recruiting them to Morgantown. He’s made it clear that he wants to focus on keeping in-state talent, but you’re not going to win many games in the Big 12 with West Virginia high school talent. The challenge of getting elite talent to Morgantown has proven to be extremely challenging in the past and it won’t get any easier with a Head Coach that will be a fish out of water during his first few years.

The Ugly: Neal Brown has no ties to West Virginia. This hire feels an awful lot like the John Beilein hiring in basketball back in 2002. Both were very respected, talented coaches that moved around quite a bit before settling at West Virginia. Neither had any previous connection whatsoever to West Virginia before being hired. If (when) Neal Brown is hugely successful at WVU, what will keep him here? Brown, following a few years of great success as the Mountaineer Head Coach, will be courted by every big-time university in the country with a coaching vacancy.

This doesn’t feel like a long-term solution. Neal Brown is the anti-Dana Holgorsen and an outstanding bridge coach to the program’s future, but to expect Brown to have any real loyalty to the program is naive. We don’t like to think of WVU as a stepping stone job, but its recent history suggests that it is.

Another major concern with Brown is recruiting. He will quickly find (if he hasn’t already) that recruiting players to WVU that can compete in the Big 12 will be a lot harder than he’s used to doing and it will be even harder because he’s recruiting them to Morgantown. He’s made it clear that he wants to focus on keeping in-state talent, but you’re not going to win many games in the Big 12 with West Virginia high school talent. The challenge of getting elite talent to Morgantown has proven to be extremely challenging in the past and it won’t get any easier with a Head Coach that will be a fish out of water during his first few years.

https://mountaineersports.com/neal-brown-isnt-perfect-or-the-good-bad-and-ugly-of-neal-brown/

Not sure of the credentials of Brad Smith, sounds more like he has a chip on his shoulder against WV media (maybe they won't hire him) than any real opinions about WVU sports in general. However, nothing he mentions is out of the realm of the existing record on NB, perhaps the recruiting assessment is off base as there seems to be some pretty darn good things happening on that front. I'd rate the article with a very strong....MEH!

 

[doneagain]

Not even coached a game and they already have him looking for another job. Can’t imagine why we aren’t a blue blood football and basketball school.

 

[Peaky BlindEER]

Sounds like an article written by a fangirl of the Coach with the woman’s name

 

[Charleston Mountie]

Not even coached a game and they already have him looking for another job. Can’t imagine why we aren’t a blue blood football and basketball school.

There are those that are desperate for Neal Brown to fail and be run out of town, fleeing from a lynch mob wielding torches and pitch forks. This must happen because they have invested their very character in the belief that Dana Holgorsen was THE MAN. If he was not the man, then neither are they.

Their fear is not that Neal Brown will be run out of town for a lack of success, but that he will be successful and never leave; relegating Dana to the scrap yard of under-performing coaches that have littered its past by comparison.

 

[skygusty]

The so called Ugly part is repeated twice? Must really be ugly. He has no West Virginia ties and if he is successful he might move on as compared to maybe getting someone who has West Virginia ties (Rich Rodriguez) and is successful and moves on. Waste of time reading this.

 

[Rootmaster]

Oh Allen...your google, cut and paste, and post stories are beginning to make you look like CFE. Please don't classify yourself however as Professional Sports Writer lol.

 

[oceantide83]

 

[oceantide83]

Instead of looking at Stepping Stone U as a bad thing, let's make it a good thing. If you're an up-and-coming hotshot coach and see that WVU sends a lot of coaches to the blue bloods, then that's a program you're going to want to go to. If you can win there, you can win anywhere. Unless you're the Product.

 

[Buckaineer]

Never really understood the desperate need of some to constantly smear Dana Holgorsen with lies and innuendo and to downrate all his accomplishments and puff up any misteps.

But Neal Brown will have to stand on his own two feet.

Every coach has " values", but what fans want are wins. If Brown isnt successful that is what he will and should be judged on. That is what will determine his success or not. Could care less if some in the fanbase " identify" with him or not. He is supposed to be all that-- lets see it quickly or move on.

If you railed against the last coach but praise the new one for having less success than the last one just because you like his " values" better than the previous staff, then you probably need to work out some things.

 

[old buzzard]

How many ties to WV did Hall of Fame Coach Don Nehlen have when he came here and elevated our program? He stayed on for 20 years and changed the way the nation perceives WVU football, and after all the years since his retirement, he's still living here doing everything he can to promote WVU in a positive light. Where is it written that you have to have WV ties to do good things for WVU?

 

[oceantide83]

How many ties to WV did Hall of Fame Coach Don Nehlen have when he came here and elevated our program? He stayed on for 20 years and changed the way the nation perceives WVU football, and after all the years since his retirement, he's still living here doing everything he can to promote WVU in a positive light. Where is it written that you have to have WV ties to do good things for WVU?

Section 107.2, Paragraph 3 of the Official WVU Fan Handbook.

 

[Rootmaster]

If you railed against the last coach but praise the new one for having less success than the last one just because you like his " values" better than the previous staff, then you probably need to work out some things.

DH had no values...nor did his man crush fan boys that still do apparently. Do you enjoy dating him down in Houston there Buck?

 

[The Dunedein]

Nattering nabobs of negativity.

 

[WVUALLEN]

Oh Allen...your google, cut and paste, and post stories are beginning to make you look like CFE. Please don't classify yourself however as Professional Sports Writer lol.

It's obvious you drink far to much. Never said I wrote it. Never classified myself as a sports writer. Just found it and decided to link the story. You don't like it, to bad.

 

[Charleston Mountie]

Never really understood the desperate need of some to constantly smear Dana Holgorsen with lies and innuendo and to downrate all his accomplishments and puff up any misteps.

But Neal Brown will have to stand on his own two feet.

Every coach has " values", but what fans want are wins. If Brown isnt successful that is what he will and should be judged on. That is what will determine his success or not. Could care less if some in the fanbase " identify" with him or not. He is supposed to be all that-- lets see it quickly or move on.

If you railed against the last coach but praise the new one for having less success than the last one just because you like his " values" better than the previous staff, then you probably need to work out some things.

Good character is never a disability but not having it, certainly is. Not understanding the difference between one over the other indicates a lack of perspective and an abundance of fluid ethics.

 

[WVUALLEN]

Never really understood the desperate need of some to constantly smear Dana Holgorsen with lies and innuendo and to downrate all his accomplishments and puff up any misteps.

But Neal Brown will have to stand on his own two feet.

Every coach has " values", but what fans want are wins. If Brown isnt successful that is what he will and should be judged on. That is what will determine his success or not. Could care less if some in the fanbase " identify" with him or not. He is supposed to be all that-- lets see it quickly or move on.

If you railed against the last coach but praise the new one for having less success than the last one just because you like his " values" better than the previous staff, then you probably need to work out some things.

I was behind Dana 100% . Then he left and or was pushed out the door. I no longer care what he does or if he wins games in Houston.

NB may not currently be better coach in P5 than the average at best coach Dana in football. But NB is a far superior man than Dana. From day one Dana was trouble being booted from a casino and drunk off his ass.

NB has ethics, class, value and teaches responsibility to players. He is a family man and builds his team to be a family and stick together as one unit. Wins or not I will support him as long as he's here.

I have more respect for Neal Brown in his first season than I did Dana's first season.

Only thing you need to do Buckey boy is worry about Big 12 TV contract extensions, OU and Texas and conference expansion.

 

[Buckaineer]

DH had no values...nor did his man crush fan boys that still do apparently. Do you enjoy dating him down in Houston there Buck?

Dana Holgorsen had many values and no doubt passed them on to his players, therby becoming one of the best ever at WVU. The things posters like you bashed him mercilessly for were mostly lies, and the things that werent like players leaving the new coach has had happen in droves himself.

You " value worshipping" people need to understand that being a good ole boy is not a value or something to idealize, and just because you arent doesnt make you bad.

Meanwhile you idol worshippers may find out rather soon just how well the new coaches " values" translate to wins.

 

[Buckaineer]

I was behind Dana 100% . Then he left and or was pushed out the door. I no longer care what he does or if he wins games in Houston.

NB may not currently be better coach in P5 than the average at best coach Dana in football. But NB is a far superior man than Dana. From day one Dana was trouble being booted from a casino and drunk off his ass.

NB has ethics, class, value and teaches responsibility to players. He is a family man and builds his team to be a family and stick together as one unit. Wins or not I will support him as long as he's here.

I have more respect for Neal Brown in his first season than I did Dana's first season.

Only thing you need to do Buckey boy is worry about Big 12 TV contract extensions, OU and Texas and conference expansion.

There is simply 0 evidence to claim Neal Brown better than or at anything than DH.

No matter what DH did you would not reapect him or WVU football.

In the end what will matter for Neal Brown is winning football games. So far with all the players he has pushed out that wont be easy.

And as far as anything else, you worry about you, I never have nor never will let a troll boy tell me what to do.

 

[Chazz Michael Michaels]

@Buckaineer
Wow. So much to disagree with in your post.
But, please enlighten us. Who has Neal Brown “run off”?
Tell us names. Is it the guys that had academic conduct issues that the school determined? Is it the wr that already skipped the bowl game due to a mystery hamstring under Dana’s watch and hadn’t returned before Neal Brown was even hired?

Or should we talk about Dana’s wonderful preparation for the bowl game or the fact that Fertita says he had already decided to go to UH and the G5 before the bowl game?

Maybe we should discuss Dana’s going 0-3 in his final 3 games in the last 2 seasons. Or his 0-7 record v OU.
Or that he never finished higher than tied for 2nd in the B12 once and 5 of 7 years was 5th or lower. He did win the orange bowl 8 yrs ago before then losing 4 of 5 bowl games including 0 for the last 3.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Expectations are a Coach Killer

Dana Holgersen's problem is that he couldn't get WV to trust his process.

But Buckaineer is correct that Neal Brown hasn't had to face the same questions yet.

Like a new wife you see the warts after a few fights and bad nights.
The question is can Neal Brown get WV to trust the process. It will be a process. Chance that you end up winning the Big 12 like Baylor and TCU only when Texas or Oklahoma are having down years.
With the way they are recruiting against each other it may not be anytime soon so Neal Brown will have to keep WV afloat and get the fans, boosters and media to trust him.

Dana couldn't and that is why he failed.
He failed because he had to promise a Big 12 Championship and it couldn't happen.

 

[VaultHunter]

People didn't like Dana because he didn't like morons like Furfari, Hickey, Hertzel, Hunter, Howe ect. Those same people think that group of mouth breathing media is fantastic.

 

[doneagain]

Expectations are a Coach Killer

Dana Holgersen's problem is that he couldn't get WV to trust his process.

But Buckaineer is correct that Neal Brown hasn't had to face the same questions yet.

Like a new wife you see the warts after a few fights and bad nights.
The question is can Neal Brown get WV to trust the process. It will be a process. Chance that you end up winning the Big 12 like Baylor and TCU only when Texas or Oklahoma are having down years.
With the way they are recruiting against each other it may not be anytime soon so Neal Brown will have to keep WV afloat and get the fans, boosters and media to trust him.

Dana couldn't and that is why he failed.
He failed because he had to promise a Big 12 Championship and it couldn't happen.

Oh come on, man.

I was a Dana fan. I wanted him to succeed and the idea that people didn’t trust his process as a reason for him not living up to expectations is just ridiculous. Dana left of his own free will. He was not fired, even after not living up to expectations in 2018, he was being given the opportunity to go out and prove himself this fall when expectations were considerably lower. One football coach was fired in the last 40 years at WVU. And the result of that was Luck wanted to bring in Dana. But Dana wanted to go somewhere that the pressure to win was not as great, and that is fine. I don’t fault him for that. It worked out well for both sides. I have absolutely no doubt Dana will be an annual 10-game winner at Houston.

As for Neal Brown, the guy had nothing to do with Dana’s departure. He does, however, give a lot of reason for optimism for the future. He wants to be at WVU. Maybe it won’t be for long, but there is no reason to panic about that at this point. Hoping Brown fails like some in this thread clearly do means hoping WVU fails. And that says more about them than anything I could say. Of course, no one will come right out and say they hope Brown fails, but it is clear where their feelings lie.

For the first time in 12 years we have a chance to put the Rod-Stew-Dana storyline behind us and try to move forward, but some would clearly rather live in the past that look to the future.

 

[Panhandleer]

I've been reading a lot of articles like this and it only proves that there are a bunch of sportswriters out there with nothing to do between the end of basketball season and the beginning of football season.The only thing we know for sure at this point is that we have a new, young and enthusiastic coach with a different approach and a new staff. That is enough to give most of us a feeling of optimism for the future. In the end, he'll be judged by what he can do with the resources he has, except by those who expect to go undefeated every season. One thing for sure, in about 45 days or so, we'll get some idea of where we are headed.

 

[Nova Mountaineer]

The Good: Brown took over a Troy team that went 3-9 the year before his arrival (2014). His team went 4-8 his first year but went 31-8 the next three years he was at Troy. Although he is considered an offensive guru because of his background as an offensive coordinator, his teams shined defensively while at Troy. New defensive coordinator Vic Koenning’s defensive squads are consistently among the nation’s top teams in takeaways. The Trojans ranked third nationally last year, forcing 31 turnovers. They were ranked 16th and fourth in the previous two seasons.

In addition, he has brought a sense of optimism and enthusiasm to the program not seen during the Dana Holgorsen era. He is a family man and the players seem to really like him so far. He will always say the right thing and make decisions based on his principles. Neal Brown is not someone that we have to worry about getting drunk and thrown out of a casino or having an affair with his secretary. He’s wholesome and he’s young and he’s talented. He’s a very good, safe hire for West Virginia.

The Bad: Troy played one team last year ranked in the Top 25 and they were defeated badly, losing 56-20 to the then 22nd-ranked Boise State team at home. They did beat Nebraska in Lincoln early in the season, but Nebraska at the beginning of the season was one of the worst teams in the nation. Troy also lost to Liberty and Appalachian State last year. During the 2017-2018 season, they averaged 30.7 points per game, which was 51st out of 130 Division I teams.

It is unlikely that Neal Brown is fully equipped to handle the pressures and challenges of the Big 12 in his first season. He will be doing a lot of on-the-job training during his first season with the Mountaineers and that will lead to growing pains. Early season out of conference games against Missouri and N.C. State could be brutal before the always tremendously-difficult Big 12 Conference schedule.

The Ugly: Neal Brown has no ties to West Virginia. This hire feels an awful lot like the John Beilein hiring in basketball back in 2002. Both were very respected, talented coaches that moved around quite a bit before settling at West Virginia. Neither had any previous connection whatsoever to West Virginia before being hired. If (when) Neal Brown is hugely successful at WVU, what will keep him here? Brown, following a few years of great success as the Mountaineer Head Coach, will be courted by every big-time university in the country with a coaching vacancy.

This doesn’t feel like a long-term solution. Neal Brown is the anti-Dana Holgorsen and an outstanding bridge coach to the program’s future, but to expect Brown to have any real loyalty to the program is naive. We don’t like to think of WVU as a stepping stone job, but its recent history suggests that it is.

Another major concern with Brown is recruiting. He will quickly find (if he hasn’t already) that recruiting players to WVU that can compete in the Big 12 will be a lot harder than he’s used to doing and it will be even harder because he’s recruiting them to Morgantown. He’s made it clear that he wants to focus on keeping in-state talent, but you’re not going to win many games in the Big 12 with West Virginia high school talent. The challenge of getting elite talent to Morgantown has proven to be extremely challenging in the past and it won’t get any easier with a Head Coach that will be a fish out of water during his first few years.

https://mountaineersports.com/neal-brown-isnt-perfect-or-the-good-bad-and-ugly-of-neal-brown/

Don didn't have any connections either when he came. DickRod did and look how that turned out.

 

[Rootmaster]

NB has ethics, class, value and teaches responsibility to players. He is a family man and builds his team to be a family and stick together as one unit. Wins or not I will support him as long as he's here.

I have more respect for Neal Brown in his first season than I did Dana's first season.

Well said.

 

[Buckaineer]

@Buckaineer
Wow. So much to disagree with in your post.
But, please enlighten us. Who has Neal Brown “run off”?
Tell us names. Is it the guys that had academic conduct issues that the school determined? Is it the wr that already skipped the bowl game due to a mystery hamstring under Dana’s watch and hadn’t returned before Neal Brown was even hired?

Since Neal Brown took over, at least 8 players-several of them KEY players have left the program. Can't tell you how many posts were made during DH's term bashing him mercilessly when one or two players left. Not aware of any of these players having any conduct issues--just the usual rumor and innuendo to smear the players rather than question the coach. according to blue gold news:https://bluegoldnews.com/west-virginia-mountaineers/movement-continues-on-wvu-transfer-front/
Junior safety Derrek Pitts and redshirt sophomore E.J. Brown are the most recent WVU players to put their names into the transfer portal, joining safety Kenny Robinson, wide receiver Marcus Simms, defensive lineman Tyrese Allen, wide receiver Dillon Spalding, defensive back Jordan Adams and offensive lineman Matt Jones.

Or should we talk about Dana’s wonderful preparation for the bowl game or the fact that Fertita says he had already decided to go to UH and the G5 before the bowl game?

WVU was within a score late in the fourth quarter with a backup QB that hadn't played much ever. The starting QB, RB and other key offensive and defensive players were out. Syracuse had a top 15 squad at the time.

It would have been a miracle for WVU to win that game with so many cards stacked against them, and WVU prepared as well as they could with the personnel they had.

Maybe we should discuss Dana’s going 0-3 in his final 3 games in the last 2 seasons. Or his 0-7 record v OU.
Or that he never finished higher than tied for 2nd in the B12 once and 5 of 7 years was 5th or lower. He did win the orange bowl 8 yrs ago before then losing 4 of 5 bowl games including 0 for the last 3.

Holgorsen had to compete against the toughest competition WVU has ever faced, with the added problem of having to travel long distances to play most games.

He started at a defecit and had lots of coaches move on, making stability that much more difficult. He also faced many many injuries late in seasons which lead to depth problems. None of these things had anything to do with lack of preparation or coaching, or "values".

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Oh come on, man.

I was a Dana fan. I wanted him to succeed and the idea that people didn’t trust his process as a reason for him not living up to expectations is just ridiculous. Dana left of his own free will. He was not fired, even after not living up to expectations in 2018, he was being given the opportunity to go out and prove himself this fall when expectations were considerably lower. One football coach was fired in the last 40 years at WVU. And the result of that was Luck wanted to bring in Dana. But Dana wanted to go somewhere that the pressure to win was not as great, and that is fine. I don’t fault him for that. It worked out well for both sides. I have absolutely no doubt Dana will be an annual 10-game winner at Houston.

As for Neal Brown, the guy had nothing to do with Dana’s departure. He does, however, give a lot of reason for optimism for the future. He wants to be at WVU. Maybe it won’t be for long, but there is no reason to panic about that at this point. Hoping Brown fails like some in this thread clearly do means hoping WVU fails. And that says more about them than anything I could say. Of course, no one will come right out and say they hope Brown fails, but it is clear where their feelings lie.

For the first time in 12 years we have a chance to put the Rod-Stew-Dana storyline behind us and try to move forward, but some would clearly rather live in the past that look to the future.

Let me ask you a true question.
I know you like to sidestep the question but this is an important one.

Neal Brown has already promised WVU to be elite.
Was he talking out of his ass when he said this.
Elite means usually conference championships and Top 10 finishes.


Will Neal Brown be asked to produce at this level?

Problem is
Is that OU needs to improve because Texas will roll right past them.
Oklahoma has to beat Texas every year so they won't.

Texas has to worry about aggy and the SEC.
They are motivated to win. They have the staff to do so. Charles Omenihu is a perfect example. 4 years of this staff he would have been a beast.
Charlie Strong's S&C program was horrible.

They are the only team in this conference that can have an elite D and elite O.
Looks like it could be heading that this year or 2020.


West Virginia needs to raise their level as well.

Only way to compete.

This takes time at a school like WV.
Not overnight
Overnight is in a weaker conference like the SunBelt or American

 

[Rootmaster]

Hey DumbBuck...are you really as dopey as you come off or is it just an act that you do well? Really.

 

[Buckaineer]

Hey root tool,

Do you want WVU to win, or do you want to worship another coach?

I don't care about your "values"--questionable at best in a message board troll anyways.

I care if Neal Brown has WVU winning at a high rate and succeeds at the levels so many railed against Holgorsen for not achieving. If its good for the goose its good for the gander.

Nothing else really matters.

 

[mofo]

Can we wait till November....

This conjecture seems
unwarranted and silly

 

[oceantide83]

Can we wait till November....

This conjecture seems
unwarranted and silly

No waiting in today's gotta have it now society.

 

[mofo]

No waiting in today's gotta have it now society.

It might take till next season

 

[Rootmaster]

Hey root tool,

Do you want WVU to win, or do you want to worship another coach?

I don't care about your "values"--questionable at best in a message board troll anyways.

I care if Neal Brown has WVU winning at a high rate and succeeds at the levels so many railed against Holgorsen for not achieving. If its good for the goose its good for the gander.

Nothing else really matters.

Hey DumbBuck...every time you respond you prove my point. You are the definition of loser lol.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Sometimes the truth hurts.

What Buckaineer is saying is not too far from the truth.
Some people just don't want to hear it.

Neal Brown will turn into Dana Holgersen if he isn't bringing the results that some people want.
Then you will find character flaws and act like there is something wrong with him.

Problem for Dana is that he let that become the narrative.
Neal Brown could be much better in his role as football coach off the field. Dana wasn't the best at this and like I said this is why he failed.
He didn't fail because of coaching he failed because this anti Dana Holgersen narrative became fact.

 

[Chazz Michael Michaels]

Robinson, Brown and Simms- left because of academic ‘issue’ (I’m being nice here) which was determined by the school and had nothing to do with Neal Brown.
Matt Jones was leaving before NB got here because he wanted to be with his girlfriend.
Spalding, Allen and Adams left because they saw they weren’t going to play a lot. Adams’ dad went on record here or TOS that they liked NB - had nothing to do with him- simply wanted more playing time.

Your excuses for how hard the schedule is, is just lame. The schedule is what it is. I liked Dana when he was here. But the bottom line is that he wasn’t very successful in the B12. His record in B12 bears that out. And, his teams often fizzled out at end of season in B12 (2012, 2015, 2017, 2018). Except for the Orange Bowl season in the BE and 2016, his other 6 seasons were either average for WVU or below average for WVU.

I agree that NB should be held to the same standard as Dana. I think NB has shown creativity, passion, hard work, organization to get over the jump- but we’ll see whether it translates to wins. It certainly won’t be for lack of effort.

Since Neal Brown took over, at least 8 players-several of them KEY players have left the program. Can't tell you how many posts were made during DH's term bashing him mercilessly when one or two players left. Not aware of any of these players having any conduct issues--just the usual rumor and innuendo to smear the players rather than question the coach. according to blue gold news:https://bluegoldnews.com/west-virginia-mountaineers/movement-continues-on-wvu-transfer-front/
Junior safety Derrek Pitts and redshirt sophomore E.J. Brown are the most recent WVU players to put their names into the transfer portal, joining safety Kenny Robinson, wide receiver Marcus Simms, defensive lineman Tyrese Allen, wide receiver Dillon Spalding, defensive back Jordan Adams and offensive lineman Matt Jones.



WVU was within a score late in the fourth quarter with a backup QB that hadn't played much ever. The starting QB, RB and other key offensive and defensive players were out. Syracuse had a top 15 squad at the time.

It would have been a miracle for WVU to win that game with so many cards stacked against them, and WVU prepared as well as they could with the personnel they had.




Holgorsen had to compete against the toughest competition WVU has ever faced, with the added problem of having to travel long distances to play most games.

He started at a defecit and had lots of coaches move on, making stability that much more difficult. He also faced many many injuries late in seasons which lead to depth problems. None of these things had anything to do with lack of preparation or coaching, or "values".

 

[doneagain]

Let me ask you a true question.
I know you like to sidestep the question but this is an important one.

Neal Brown has already promised WVU to be elite.
Was he talking out of his ass when he said this.
Elite means usually conference championships and Top 10 finishes.


Will Neal Brown be asked to produce at this level?

Problem is
Is that OU needs to improve because Texas will roll right past them.
Oklahoma has to beat Texas every year so they won't.

Texas has to worry about aggy and the SEC.
They are motivated to win. They have the staff to do so. Charles Omenihu is a perfect example. 4 years of this staff he would have been a beast.
Charlie Strong's S&C program was horrible.

They are the only team in this conference that can have an elite D and elite O.
Looks like it could be heading that this year or 2020.


West Virginia needs to raise their level as well.

Only way to compete.

This takes time at a school like WV.
Not overnight
Overnight is in a weaker conference like the SunBelt or American

Looks like I have gotten under your skin. So I am wondering about your comment about not trusting Dana’s process, yet your belief that WVU should be happy settling for table scraps and knowing it’s place. So either WVU has no shot to ever do anything, or we trust the process of Dana and we excel... which is it?

Your question is dumb for the simple reason that every coach promises the moon when they get hired.

Regardless, since my response is clearly important to you, I will answer your question.

No man or woman on earth can tell the future.

I do know that WVU started a women’s soccer program less than 25 years ago and have been the dominant program in the B12, winning 5 straight conference regular season titles, and playing in the national championship game a couple of years ago. The WVU rifle team is the elite program in the country, winning 19 national championships. With the comparatively limited resources WVU has, there is no reason all other big time schools shouldn’t be doing better in those sports than WVU.

WVU has played for a national championship in football in 1988. We would have made the playoffs in 93 had they existed since we finished the regular season 11-0 and ranked #3. We would have been in the national title game in 2007 had RichRod not blown the game against Pitt. So the flashes of greatness have been there, which to me suggests the potential is there.

Comparatively speaking, Texas has all the resources in the world and has never made a final four, while little ole WVU has been to 2.

We are one of less than 10 schools to have played in at least 35 bowls and made at least 25 NCAA tournaments.

Had we had the benefit of being a part of a traditional all sports conference for the last 70 years like so many of today’s “elite” schools, there is no telling where we would be. Imagine where Texas would be if they had not had incompetent leadership wasting resources and making bad decision after bad decision.

If we had all the resources Texas has had and wasted, shoot, we would be the most successful program of all time.

So pound for pound, all things considered, resource to resource, WVU is one of the most successful schools in the country, period.

There is no reason WVU can’t be an elite school with the complete commitment from its stakeholders. So, no, Neal Brown was not just talking out of his butt.

 

[mofo]

Looks like I have gotten under your skin. So I am wondering about your comment about not trusting Dana’s process, yet your belief that WVU should be happy settling for table scraps and knowing it’s place. So either WVU has no shot to ever do anything, or we trust the process of Dana and we excel... which is it?

Your question is dumb for the simple reason that every coach promises the moon when they get hired.

Regardless, since my response is clearly important to you, I will answer your question.

No man or woman on earth can tell the future.

I do know that WVU started a women’s soccer program less than 25 years ago and have been the dominant program in the B12, winning 5 straight conference regular season titles, and playing in the national championship game a couple of years ago. The WVU rifle team is the elite program in the country, winning 19 national championships. With the comparatively limited resources WVU has, there is no reason all other big time schools shouldn’t be doing better in those sports than WVU.

WVU has played for a national championship in football in 1988. We would have made the playoffs in 93 had they existed since we finished the regular season 11-0 and ranked #3. We would have been in the national title game in 2007 had RichRod not blown the game against Pitt. So the flashes of greatness have been there, which to me suggests the potential is there.

Comparatively speaking, Texas has all the resources in the world and has never made a final four, while little ole WVU has been to 2.

We are one of less than 10 schools to have played in at least 35 bowls and made at least 25 NCAA tournaments.

Had we had the benefit of being a part of a traditional all sports conference for the last 70 years like so many of today’s “elite” schools, there is no telling where we would be. Imagine where Texas would be if they had not had incompetent leadership wasting resources and making bad decision after bad decision.

If we had all the resources Texas has had and wasted, shoot, we would be the most successful program of all time.

So pound for pound, all things considered, resource to resource, WVU is one of the most successful schools in the country, period.

There is no reason WVU can’t be an elite school with the complete commitment from its stakeholders. So, no, Neal Brown was not just talking out of his butt.

Great summary

 

[dave]

The Good: Brown took over a Troy team that went 3-9 the year before his arrival (2014). His team went 4-8 his first year but went 31-8 the next three years he was at Troy. Although he is considered an offensive guru because of his background as an offensive coordinator, his teams shined defensively while at Troy. New defensive coordinator Vic Koenning’s defensive squads are consistently among the nation’s top teams in takeaways. The Trojans ranked third nationally last year, forcing 31 turnovers. They were ranked 16th and fourth in the previous two seasons.

In addition, he has brought a sense of optimism and enthusiasm to the program not seen during the Dana Holgorsen era. He is a family man and the players seem to really like him so far. He will always say the right thing and make decisions based on his principles. Neal Brown is not someone that we have to worry about getting drunk and thrown out of a casino or having an affair with his secretary. He’s wholesome and he’s young and he’s talented. He’s a very good, safe hire for West Virginia.

The Bad: Troy played one team last year ranked in the Top 25 and they were defeated badly, losing 56-20 to the then 22nd-ranked Boise State team at home. They did beat Nebraska in Lincoln early in the season, but Nebraska at the beginning of the season was one of the worst teams in the nation. Troy also lost to Liberty and Appalachian State last year. During the 2017-2018 season, they averaged 30.7 points per game, which was 51st out of 130 Division I teams.

It is unlikely that Neal Brown is fully equipped to handle the pressures and challenges of the Big 12 in his first season. He will be doing a lot of on-the-job training during his first season with the Mountaineers and that will lead to growing pains. Early season out of conference games against Missouri and N.C. State could be brutal before the always tremendously-difficult Big 12 Conference schedule.

The Ugly: Neal Brown has no ties to West Virginia. This hire feels an awful lot like the John Beilein hiring in basketball back in 2002. Both were very respected, talented coaches that moved around quite a bit before settling at West Virginia. Neither had any previous connection whatsoever to West Virginia before being hired. If (when) Neal Brown is hugely successful at WVU, what will keep him here? Brown, following a few years of great success as the Mountaineer Head Coach, will be courted by every big-time university in the country with a coaching vacancy.

This doesn’t feel like a long-term solution. Neal Brown is the anti-Dana Holgorsen and an outstanding bridge coach to the program’s future, but to expect Brown to have any real loyalty to the program is naive. We don’t like to think of WVU as a stepping stone job, but its recent history suggests that it is.

Another major concern with Brown is recruiting. He will quickly find (if he hasn’t already) that recruiting players to WVU that can compete in the Big 12 will be a lot harder than he’s used to doing and it will be even harder because he’s recruiting them to Morgantown. He’s made it clear that he wants to focus on keeping in-state talent, but you’re not going to win many games in the Big 12 with West Virginia high school talent. The challenge of getting elite talent to Morgantown has proven to be extremely challenging in the past and it won’t get any easier with a Head Coach that will be a fish out of water during his first few years.

https://mountaineersports.com/neal-brown-isnt-perfect-or-the-good-bad-and-ugly-of-neal-brown/

What ignorant fool wrote that garbage? I would love to mock that moron to his or her stupid face.

 

[dave]

Dana Holgorsen had many values and no doubt passed them on to his players, therby becoming one of the best ever at WVU. The things posters like you bashed him mercilessly for were mostly lies, and the things that werent like players leaving the new coach has had happen in droves himself.

You " value worshipping" people need to understand that being a good ole boy is not a value or something to idealize, and just because you arent doesnt make you bad.

Meanwhile you idol worshippers may find out rather soon just how well the new coaches " values" translate to wins.

Well arent you just special.