what in the world happened to our offense?
- Thread starter BombadEER
- Start date
Mr. Mediocre must have started calling the plays. He's a loser 100 times over. Proves it every year.
This loss is on the coaches. They played the 2nd half conservative. A coach should know that you have to keep your foot on that happy pedal. Know what I mean? Hold on a minute............the defense made the Oklahoma State offense look like All Americans in the 2nd half. They could not stop OK State! Warez
SpookyCatBoy......I must admit..............that game provided entertainment at it's finest. Yes, the wrong team won but still..........entertainment? Heck yes! Warez
The offense didn't lose the game, if you can't stop the run you have little chance of winning regardless of your offensive performance.
Offense failed to take advantage of FOUR turnovers by defense and special teams. The loss is on the offense and the defense this time. Plenty of blame to go around. And Grier and Sills didn't come through at the end when ONE good play would have won the game.
But, beat Oklahoma and WVU is in the Big 12 title game, probably against Texas, which only has to beat Kansas. Who knew that Oklahoma might be sitting at home watching the Big 12 title game. College football: Unpredictable as all get-out. And Oklahoma State, which beat Texas and WVU, is one rung above last place Kansas in the Big 12 standings. Freaky, huh?
M agnificent Grier passes shredded Tennessee, 40-14
O verhelmed drenched Youngstown, 52-17
U nable to play North Carolina State because of Hurricane Florence
N asty defense against Kansas State, 35-6
T errific, then timid on offense against Texas Tech, 42-34
A ntsy time for fans, vs. Kansas!, 38-22
I ncomprehensible insanely indescribably inept offense against Iowa State, 14-30
N ailed Baylor, 58-14
E rectile dysfunctioned Texas on 2-point PAT, 42-41
E viscerated TCU, 47-10
R etching collapse at Oklahoma State, 41-45
S avagely skewer Oklahoma & play for Big 12 title vs. Texas
But, beat Oklahoma and WVU is in the Big 12 title game, probably against Texas, which only has to beat Kansas. Who knew that Oklahoma might be sitting at home watching the Big 12 title game. College football: Unpredictable as all get-out. And Oklahoma State, which beat Texas and WVU, is one rung above last place Kansas in the Big 12 standings. Freaky, huh?
M agnificent Grier passes shredded Tennessee, 40-14
O verhelmed drenched Youngstown, 52-17
U nable to play North Carolina State because of Hurricane Florence
N asty defense against Kansas State, 35-6
T errific, then timid on offense against Texas Tech, 42-34
A ntsy time for fans, vs. Kansas!, 38-22
I ncomprehensible insanely indescribably inept offense against Iowa State, 14-30
N ailed Baylor, 58-14
E rectile dysfunctioned Texas on 2-point PAT, 42-41
E viscerated TCU, 47-10
R etching collapse at Oklahoma State, 41-45
S avagely skewer Oklahoma & play for Big 12 title vs. Texas
"Offense failed to take advantage of FOUR turnovers by defense and special teams."
In a world where actual facts don't matter................. WVU got 10 points off the 2 TOs in the first half.
In a world where actual facts don't matter................. WVU got 10 points off the 2 TOs in the first half.
WVex-pat in GA........you are right on the money. Some folks seem to think it is the job of the offense to just score and score and score until they have enough points to win. The defense gotta be held accountable for that! Warez
Don't miss the ball on the tee...but this is a good post! Yeah....it's me and I think so lol.
I see your point, but when you have a 3 score lead at half against one of the worst defenses in the conference, that 17 point spot should be enough to out pace the opposition if the offense is remotely competent.
Which is subpar when it's supposed to be a great offense going against an objectively bad defense.
Except that Dana is building this program on the notion of a great offense that can out gun the opposition. I don't agree with this approach and think the defense definitely needs to be shored up. However, in Dana's model of coaching the defense did enough to give WVU a comfortable lead going into the second half. The defense clearly had the much tougher assignment in stopping the obviously good OSU offense compared to the WVU offense having to score against the obviously below average OSU defense. Just like TTU, its self inflicted if you get shut down an entire half by a subpar defense.
Last edited:
Well not really when you look at it objectively..............
on TO #1, we scored a TD afterward.
on TO #2, we ran the ball all the way to our 1 yard line and did not convert. While we could have easily went for the FG and got 3 points...... we were in a position to roll the dice. Points or no, we pinned OSU back into their own endzone all while burning a lot of clock........ their ensuing possession led to a quick punt too, meaning our possession did positively impact the field position game.
on TO#3, WVU intercepted the ball to stop an end-of-half OSU drive, leaving our offense with only about 30 seconds left to run down the entire field for a score. We got a long FG out of it.
on TO #4, WVU got another field goal out of the following possession......
So it wasn't +10 points off of 4 TOs............. it was +13. And could have been +16 if Dana wanted to be conservative and kick an easy FG instead of going for the TD on 4th down.
WVU scores 13 points off of 4 OSU TOs
OSU scores 3 points off of 2 WVU TOs
Saying this had an impact at all just another way to deflect from Tony Gibson’s horrible defensive coaching
OSU scores 3 points off of 2 WVU TOs
Saying this had an impact at all just another way to deflect from Tony Gibson’s horrible defensive coaching
I concede that I forgot about the second FG. That being said, why is it with you that 2 things can't be true at the same time? It's true that Gibson and the defense just aren't getting it done when it really matters. It's also true that the offense has also not gotten it done when it mattered most. I postulate that the defense having less returning starters, more injuries, and in this particular case going up against a solid offense can't hold more blame than the supposed veteran offense led by an offensive minded coach against a bad defense when they both under perform. You can't say the offense did its job getting 31 points in the first half without acknowledging that the defense did well to only give up 14. Same is true for TTU in that the offense doesnt get 5 first quarter possessions without the defense getting 4 quick stops. Sure the offense bailed out the defense against Texas, but the defense bailed out the offense against TTU. Let's not forget that the 10 win season with Skyler Howard was possible because of a Tony Gibson led defense. Again, this is not to excuse Gibson or the awful defense in this game or this season. It's just to point out that you can't deflect from the offense under performing by pointing out the instances where it was good if the same cannot be done with the defense. No doubt the offense should be expected to get more than 10 points in a half against a seive like defense or mount a decent drive when the game is on the line.
This guy gets it. The way this teams build the offense can't disappear for a whole quarter or half. WVU should be playing the way that 10 win team did. Build the D up and find a QB that is also a real threat to run.
I'll also throw it out there that the defense has at least put together an entire game when playing average or worse offenses more often than not. Tenn, YSU, KSU, TCU, Baylor all held to 3 scores or less for the entire game (all but one of those to 2 scores or less). I'll throw Kansas in there as they got a TD as time expired when game was out of hand to get above 3 scores. ISU is a fail given they average 25.3 ppg, although with Purdy at QB it has been 30.5 ppg, but I'll give that one. Texas I'd not put at average with a 32.36 ppg average. So out of 7 games where the defense played a team without a good offense, they failed to play adequately most of the game once. For the offense it is understandable that when the rout is on and stays on that they have an unimpressive stretch of game when scoring is not needed. So that that can explain the low scoring halves involving Tennessee, KSU, YSU. Against ISU and Texas who give up 20.8 ppg and 25.9 respectively WVU had at least one half of less than 2 scores. I'll agree that those two are arguably above average defensively (UT barely). Against TTU at 30.7 ppg (33.8 if you ignore the goose egg they held the mighty Lamar to) and OSU at 32.54 ppg (36.4 if you ignore games against juggernauts Montana State and Southern Alabama) the offense had 2 halves of 10 points or less. These were halves where WVU really needed a score to either win or put the game away. That's at least twice the offense has failed to live up to its billing against average or worse competition when the pressure was on. Even more damning when considering the defensive ceiling was "better than average" while the offensive ceiling was "elite" going into the season.
Yeah 41 points and a 17 point lead.
What the heck happened to the offense!
No offense but Tony Gibson is going to be looking for a new job in conference USA or the Sun Belt.
And I will laugh at all these "by gosh it's good enough because it ain't fair" Gibson good ol boys.
What the heck happened to the offense!
No offense but Tony Gibson is going to be looking for a new job in conference USA or the Sun Belt.
And I will laugh at all these "by gosh it's good enough because it ain't fair" Gibson good ol boys.
This board will never talk bad about Tony
He’s “one of us”
The man from Van
And a DC who has yet to field a top 50 defense
He’s “one of us”
The man from Van
And a DC who has yet to field a top 50 defense
You keep saying that as though it completely negates any criticism toward the head coach or offensive coaches. First, it's the head coach that could easily replace Gibson if he wanted. Unless you think he's being held hostage by a cadre of West Virginians. Secondly, Gibson's crap defense did not underachieve its capabilities in the OSU game more than the offense did given the offense is the better unit playing the worse competition. So, while what you say is true it does not justify ignoring this fact.
There you go again. I know you are not stupid, so this is pure intellectual disingenuousness. Never did I say that Gibson's defense didn't underachieve. I just said they underachieved less than offense when you account for what each units capabilities are and who they were going against.
Last edited:
Bell...you are given Keatonsdumbass more credit than he can garner intellectually lol. And, you have to wonder about a poster who likes to tell us all how insightful they are about WVU sports and then constantly trashes the state and anyone still connected to it. Maybe Keaton is bored down in mommy's basement. Who knows?
I call it like I see it. He is not stupid. He is a rigid guy with an agenda. He has an axe to grind against Gibson and for some a reason a need to ignore criticism of the head coach or offensive coaching. Hence, he deflects and tries to set up a straw men to knock down rather than actually opposing someone's arguments. I actually agree with his statement that Gibson overall hasn't been all that great. He has had some moments that Keaton chooses to ignore, but overall he is not getting the job done. I don't buy into this idea that since no one else in the Big XII plays defense that WVU shouldn't be too worried about it. I believe WVU should aspire on being the best defense in the Big XII on top of being the best or at least pretty good on offense. All that being said, the defense did enough that this offense should've still won the last game. Also shouldn't have been nail biters against Texas and TTU or definitive loss against ISU.
Or ... there is this.
How did that 'Horns Down" work out for us?
Did we piss off every official in the Big XII?
Was ALL of the non-pass interference calls our payback?
Do we have more payback coming against OU?
Lets hope not. Tip to the players - Shut up and play the game.
How did that 'Horns Down" work out for us?
Did we piss off every official in the Big XII?
Was ALL of the non-pass interference calls our payback?
Do we have more payback coming against OU?
Lets hope not. Tip to the players - Shut up and play the game.
lol, our offense produced 41 points............
our season average - 41 points.........
That's literally not underachieving at all. Not even one point. That's the definition of achieving.
2 things. OSU is the worst scoring defense WVU has played this season and should have exceeded its average. Second, ISU and OU managed to still win despite OSU putting up 40+ points. In another post I explained in great detail using numbers which you love to throw around at times as to how the offense has spent 30 minutes of football getting 2 scores or less against sub top 50 scoring defenses when the game was on the line. Throwing up points against the little sisters of the poor when the defense gives you extra possessions (be it good play by the defense or opposing offensive ineptitude) isn't important during crunch time. The Texas game is the only time they came through in the clutch after a few scoreless possessions. TTU would've gone the way of OSU had the defense not gotten a pick 6.
lol, shew......
OSU gives up 32.5 a game
Baylor gives up 32 a game
Texas gives up 31 a game
TTU gives up 31 a game
KU gives up 31 a game
and Oklahoma gives up 31 a game
dude is really trying to make a point about a point.
And your lil TTU theory is pure revisionist history.............
What happened to offense at half-time of OSU game? Simple Dana and Jake
decided they didn't want to beat up on their coaching OSU.
decided they didn't want to beat up on their coaching OSU.
And you are trying real hard to ignore that the offense was held to 2 scores or less in the 2nd half during 4 games against all but one top 50 scoring defense despite having every motivation to score. Before Saturday only a crazy person would say it'd be more surprising for the defense to give up 45 points than the offense to only score 10 in a half. The defense being all the things you say does not mean the offense didn't screw up as well or that it hasn't done so in 4 tightly contested games.
Last edited:
In case you missed it the first time...
It's like playing baseball knowing the 7, 8, 9 guys can't hit for crap, but you have 1-4 guys that you know can knock the cover off the ball so you plan on riding them. Then when they suck it up in crunch time, you go yell at the 7, 8, and 9 guys for being exactly what they've proven to be during the season and ignore the guys who did the opposite of what they've proven to be capable of doing.
Second, NCAA numbers.
1. Defense: WVU is currently 44th in scoring defense across the NCAA. That is with playing scoring offenses of OSU (14th), TTU (17th), Texas (41st), Baylor (77th), ISU (93rd), Kansas (99th), TCU (102nd), Tennessee (105th), KSU (117th). Average of 73.8 and median of 93
The WVU defense gave up more than 2 total scores to 14, 17, 41, 93, and 99 scoring offenses. In those games WVU held 14 to 14 points in a half, 17 to 10 points in a half, 41st to 13 points in a half, 93 to 10 points in a half, and 99 to 7 points in a half. None of these games involved the other team winning going away. 99 forgivable given it was a garbage time TD and 2pt conversion at 0:00 on the clock. 93 an embarrassment. Other 3 games against top 50 scoring offenses.
2. Offense: WVU is currently 10th in scoring offense across the NCAA. That is with playing scoring defenses of ISU (25th), KSU (46th), TCU (50th), Texas (56th), Tennessee (66th), Kansas (84th), TTU (86th), Baylor (93rd), OSU (99th). Average 67.2 and median 66.
The WVU offense held to 2 scores or less in one half against 25, 46, 56, 66, 86, and 99. In those games WVU was held scoreless against 25 in second half being down by just one score at half, held to 14 against 46 in second half while going in up 21, held to 14 against 56 while trailing entire second half until last minute TD and 2pt conversion, held to 13 in the first half against 66th before catching fire 2nd half, held scoreless against 86 despite rallying to outscore the WVU offense yet be saved by defensive TD, held to 10 points against 99 while opposition rallies to outscore the WVU offense. Forgivable for 46 given beingcomfortably ahead and for 66 given it was the first half and they really turned it on when it mattered. Ultimately the WVU offense was held to 2 scores or less in the second half when the game was on the line against 25, 56, 86, 99. That is only one top 50 scoring defense and 2 below the NCAA average for scoring defenses.
The point is that when the WVU defense was expected to be a liability, it definitely was. When the WVU offense was needed to be and expected to be a strength … it was a liability.
Third, Big XII numbers.
WVU is 2/2 in scoring offense and scoringdefense respectively. That is the best combination in the league. OU (1/7), ISU (7/1), Texas (5/5), TTU (4/7), OSU (3/10), TCU (9/4), KSU (10/3), Kansas (8/6), Baylor (6/9). So few teams play great defense in this league and no team is really good at both with the exception of perhaps WVU by the numbers.
Conclusion: When it is all thrown together, I think its a strong argument that because the offense has less injuries, the "better coaching," more talent, and more returning starters it is more damning that they have crapped the bed in critical situations against very beatable opposition 3 times as opposed to the defense not having any of the advantages mentioned above crapping the bed against only one similarly disadvantaged opponent and the rest being at least top 50.
https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/28/p2
http://www.big12sports.com/fls/10410/pdfs/football/2018OverallStats.pdf?&DB_OEM_ID=10410
