Republicans Are Getting Ready to Repeat Kansas’ Tax Cut Disaster

[moe]

https://slate.com/business/2017/11/republicans-are-about-to-repeat-kansas-tax-cut-disaster.html

Suffice to say, cutting taxes on these businesses didn’t do Kansas’ economy much good. Instead a jobs boom, the state found itself slogging through years of unimpressive growth and massive budget deficits as its tax base disappeared, forcing lawmakers to cut spending on [URL='http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics-government/article9376751.html']public schools, colleges, Medicaid, and more. The state’s credit rating was humiliatingly downgraded. Eventually, legislators got fed up with the pain, and this year they finally voted to reverse the cuts, with Republicans joining Democrats to override Brownback’s veto.[/URL]

In April, a group of economists took stock of the Kansas misadventure, using administrative tax data to figure out whether the cuts had done any good at all. In short, the researchers concluded, they had not. The main effect, it seemed, was that business owners relabeled some of their income as “profits” rather than wages in order to cut their tax bills. Business investment by passthroughs actually seemed to decline slightly.

 

[WVUCOOPER]

https://slate.com/business/2017/11/republicans-are-about-to-repeat-kansas-tax-cut-disaster.html

Suffice to say, cutting taxes on these businesses didn’t do Kansas’ economy much good. Instead a jobs boom, the state found itself slogging through years of unimpressive growth and massive budget deficits as its tax base disappeared, forcing lawmakers to cut spending on public schools, colleges, Medicaid, and more. The state’s credit rating was humiliatingly downgraded. Eventually, legislators got fed up with the pain, and this year they finally voted to reverse the cuts, with Republicans joining Democrats to override Brownback’s veto.

In April, a group of economists took stock of the Kansas misadventure, using administrative tax data to figure out whether the cuts had done any good at all. In short, the researchers concluded, they had not. The main effect, it seemed, was that business owners relabeled some of their income as “profits” rather than wages in order to cut their tax bills. Business investment by passthroughs actually seemed to decline slightly.

I just don't think it's accurate to a) compare a state's economy with the national economy and b) the Kansas Tax cuts and the proposed federal tax cuts.

 

[bamaEER]

Admittedly, they're making lots of last minute changes to the bill to win support from the likes of Biff's GOP enemies like Murkowski and McCain, so I'm not really sure what is in it at this point. They did add measures to increase tax revenue if projections run short and some other things. No one (left or right) seems to be that excited about it.

 

[moe]

I just don't think it's accurate to a) compare a state's economy with the national economy and b) the Kansas Tax cuts and the proposed federal tax cuts.

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

I think you actually believe what you’re typing.

 

[Airport]

Admittedly, they're making lots of last minute changes to the bill to win support from the likes of Biff's GOP enemies like Murkowski and McCain, so I'm not really sure what is in it at this point. They did add measures to increase tax revenue if projections run short and some other things. No one (left or right) seems to be that excited about it.

Murkowski wants some of the artic area opened for drilling. Got it from what I heard.

 

[Airport]

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

And it increased how much in the last 8 years? Doubled is the number I've heard thrown around. Is that correct or was I hearing things?

 

[WVUCOOPER]

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

I mean, that actually is true. And Kansas cut PTE rates to 0%. The current plan, I believe, will tax PTE income up to 25%

I totes understand how people can be opposed to this plan, but the Kansas comparisons are flat out wrong for a dozen reasons.

 

[WVUBRU]

I just don't think it's accurate to a) compare a state's economy with the national economy and b) the Kansas Tax cuts and the proposed federal tax cuts.

It is comparable in terms they are both based on the same failed supply side economic policy pushed forward by the same type of morons.

 

[countryroads89]

Keep trying it enough times, it might eventually work.....no, no it won't.

 

[TarHeelEer]

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

Many states cut taxes, but only Kansas is ever brought up by the left. Why is that?

 

[TarHeelEer]

It is comparable in terms they are both based on the same failed supply side economic policy pushed forward by the same type of morons.

GET OFF MY LAWN!

 

[countryroads89]

Just imagine if you were a business owner and you could petition the federal government to lower your taxes, all it depended on was your ability to convince them why you should pay lower taxes.

(In my best Mr. Haney from Green Acres voice)

Boy, have I got a deal for you. Uncle Sam, if you lower my taxes, I'll take that money and reinvest in my business and magically, regardless of supply and demand, my business will grow. My sales will go up, simply because I am "reinvesting" in my business. Then I will have to hire more people and you will be getting more income tax from the new employees not to mention the additional tax from my increased business. Now keep in mind, there is no obligation on my part to spend the tax savings on my business. Let's say, if I get a hankering for a new truck or boat or tractor, or if I simply want to stick that money in my bank account and let it just sit there, I can do that.

What do you say Uncle Sam? That's a deal you can't pass up. It's almost too good to be true.

 

[Mntneer]

Let's say, if I get a hankering for a new truck or boat or tractor, or if I simply want to stick that money in my bank account and let it just sit there, I can do that.

So boat and auto manufacturers wouldn't like selling more of their products?

And what do you think a bank does with the money you put in your accounts?

 

[countryroads89]

So boat and auto manufacturers wouldn't like selling more of their products?

And what do you think a bank does with the money you put in your accounts?

The bank earns a fraction of the amount you stick in the bank. The government then taxes a fraction of that fraction.

Mr. Haney says it's been a pleasure doing business with you.

 

[Mntneer]

The bank earns a fraction of the amount you stick in the bank. The government then taxes a fraction of that fraction.

Mr. Haney says it's been a pleasure doing business with you.

You didn't answer the question..... well... I guess you attempted to but failed miserably at it.

 

[WVUCOOPER]

So boat and auto manufacturers wouldn't like selling more of their products?

And what do you think a bank does with the money you put in your accounts?

Lending/banking reforms would help MUCH better than tax cuts for that argument.

 

[bamaEER]

Lending/banking reforms would help MUCH better than tax cuts for that argument.

‘Reform’ sounds too much like big bad govt invasion. Now ‘tax cut’ on the other hand.....

 

[countryroads89]

Lending/banking reforms would help MUCH better than tax cuts for that argument.

Either way, the government only get's back a very small fraction of what they would have received in tax revenue. Mr. Haney taking the 50,000 dollar tax break to purchase the truck means the government didn't get 50,000 dollars but did get a small fraction of the 50,000 dollars. Mr. Haney is thrilled. Thanks Uncle Sam.

Duh!!

 

[Mntneer]

Lending/banking reforms would help MUCH better than tax cuts for that argument.

I don't disagree there.

The notion however that money from tax cuts gets stuffed into mattresses is absurd.

 

[countryroads89]

I don't disagree there.

The notion however that money from tax cuts gets stuffed into mattresses is absurd.

The regular folk get such a small amount from tax cuts it is really meaningless and gets spent. The wealthy get such a substantial amount that it really doesn't get spent. The majority goes to some sort of savings. This is well known.

 

[WVUCOOPER]

Either way, the government only get's back a very small fraction of what they would have received in tax revenue. Mr. Haney taking the 50,000 dollar tax break to purchase the truck means the government didn't get 50,000 dollars but did get a small fraction of the 50,000 dollars. Mr. Haney is thrilled. Thanks Uncle Sam.

Duh!!

Umm...what? How about the salesman, dealership, manufacturer and subsidiary businesses for the truck sold?

 

[WVUCOOPER]

I don't disagree there.

The notion however that money from tax cuts gets stuffed into mattresses is absurd.

Meh. We'll see. I'd say it depends on the tax (individual/corporate/death) and other outside factors. A payroll tax cut would probably be the most likely to stay out of mattresses.

 

[countryroads89]

Umm...what? How about the salesman, dealership, manufacturer and subsidiary businesses for the truck sold?

Gonna take a lot of adding up to eventually make it back to that 50,000 dollars, especially when we're talking about fractions, say neighborhood of 20%.

 

[WVUCOOPER]

Gonna take a lot of adding up to eventually make it back to that 50,000 dollars, especially when we're talking about fractions, say neighborhood of 20%.

Possibly. In the mean time we might actually get people working for money. At least until the robots take over.

 

[countryroads89]

Possibly. In the mean time we might actually get people working for money. At least until the robots take over.

I'm not the economic expert here....so we're implementing a gimmick tax plan that is really only intended for desperate times when we need a gimmick to stimulate the economy? And we're not currently in a recession?
And it will add to our current astronomical debt?

Amiright?

 

[moe]

Many states cut taxes, but only Kansas is ever brought up by the left. Why is that?

Examples of states making similar cuts would be?

 

[WVUCOOPER]

I'm not the economic expert here....so we're implementing a gimmick tax plan that is really only intended for desperate times when we need a gimmick to stimulate the economy? And we're not currently in a recession?
And it will add to our current astronomical debt?

Amiright?

I don't think it's a gimmick. Our corporate rates are too high.

 

[WVUCOOPER]

Examples of states making similar cuts would be?

Ohio.

 

[Snow Sled Baby]

True, when Kansas's tax revenues fell short they had to make draconian budget cuts but the Fed government doesn't have to balance its books so they can just increase the national debt if tax revenues fall short and the money doesn't trickle down somehow

we're not in kansas anymore totomoe

 

[Snow Sled Baby]

I don't think it's a gimmick. Our corporate rates are too high.

it's a gimmick because Trump champions it........if it had Bernie's or hillary's name attached to it it would be the greatest tax plan ever made.....you should have the liberal mentality (if there is one) figured out by now

 

[WVUCOOPER]

it's a gimmick because Trump champions it........if it had Bernie's or hillary's name attached to it it would be the greatest tax plan ever made.....you should have the liberal mentality (if there is one) figured out by now

Yes yes...liberal = bad, Trump = good. What a simple world you must live in.

 

[Snow Sled Baby]

It is comparable in terms they are both based on the same failed supply side economic policy pushed forward by the same type of morons.

is everyone in the world a moron except for you and your chosen few lib confidants?......if so then how do you force yourself to exist in a world where you think that EVERYONE is beneath you?.....and just what in the hell do you think lived in the white house the last 8 years?....waaah waaah waaaaah

 

[Snow Sled Baby]

Yes yes...liberal = bad, Trump = good. What a simple world you must live in.

no.....Trump...trying to do good.........liberal...trying to keep Trump from doing good

 

[MichiganHerd]

Amiright?

Have you ever been?

 

[TarHeelEer]

Examples of states making similar cuts would be?

North Carolina for one. Deficits to surpluses.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

The regular folk get such a small amount from tax cuts it is really meaningless and gets spent.

Right, that’s the point. And what do they spend them on? And what do those sales get? And the businesses that get those increased sales...?

Hahahhaa thanks for proving you agree with tax cuts.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

Examples of states making similar cuts would be?

Ohio, Michigan, North Carolina, Texas, FL to name a few.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

I'm not the economic expert here....

Can you make that your signature?

 

[WVUCOOPER]

Ohio, Michigan, North Carolina, Texas, FL to name a few.

Texas and FL cut their PTE tax? Haven't they been zero for awhile?