Just for kicks let's give the Left their argument...

[atlkvb]

...that the Russians "hacked" the DNC's e-mails. (We still don't know this for sure, but let's assume they did)

OK, their argument is that they (Russians) did it to influence or change the election results to Trump right? (As if they knew Clinton would've won otherwise?)

Fine. How did they know this? Most importantly, what was it in the actual e-mails that convinced them would change everyone's minds from Clinton in favor of Trump?

See, this is what I still don't hear anyone on the Left defending, that what was actually in those leaked e-mail leaks was all "made up"! Not even the victims (Podesta et all etc) are denying that the corruption, bigotry, viciousness, and arguably illegal activities the Dems were engaged in and revealed in those e mail leaks is all true. Yet the Dem Left isn't upset about any of that... oh no....they're just pissed off that the Russians decided to leak all of this sewage in order to flip the election results to Trump. Unreal.

Moreover despite all of those leaks both the Dems and the mainstream News media that virtually ignored the revelations, kept insisting through their constantly biased polling that the election was in the bag for crooked Hillary!

If you really think about it, it's the most asinine, convoluted argument a Democratic supporter can make on all points. At the very least it shows the Russians were apparently a lot smarter than the Party that was asking us to trust the future of our country to it's leadership.

Glad we didn't buy their sales pitch.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

...that the Russians "hacked" the DNC's e-mails. (We still don't know this for sure, but let's assume they did)

OK, their argument is that they (Russians) did it to influence or change the election results to Trump right? (As if they knew Clinton would've won otherwise?)

Fine. How did they know this? Most importantly, what was it in the actual e-mails that convinced them would change everyone's minds from Clinton in favor of Trump?

See, this is what I still don't hear anyone on the Left defending, that what was actually in those leaked e-mail leaks was all "made up"! Not even the victims (Podesta et all etc) are denying that the corruption, bigotry, viciousness, and arguably illegal activities the Dems were engaged in and revealed in those e mail leaks is all true. Yet the Dem Left isn't upset about any of that... oh no....they're just pissed off that the Russians decided to leak all of this sewage in order to flip the election results to Trump. Unreal.

Moreover despite all of those leaks both the Dems and the mainstream News media that virtually ignored the revelations, kept insisting through their constantly biased polling that the election was in the bag for crooked Hillary!

If you really think about it, it's the most asinine, convoluted argument a Democratic supporter can make on all points. At the very least it shows the Russians were apparently a lot smarter than the Party that was asking us to trust the future of our country to it's leadership.

Glad we didn't buy their sales pitch.

Pretty well stated.

 

[roadtrasheer]

Democrats seem to always want to keep bailing water & never fix the hole .....they never want to fix the root problem & sadly alot of Republicans do the same

 

[atlkvb]

Democrats seem to always want to keep bailing water & never fix the hole .....they never want to fix the root problem & sadly alot of Republicans do the same

I wish I could pack all of them into one of Elon Musk's Mars starships and shoot 'em off into deep interstellar space so they can all eventually set up their fantasy Utopia somewhere else in the middle of nowhere and leave the rest of us the Hell alone.

John Lennon used to "Imagine" no Country? Well "imagine" no Lefties?

 

[Boomboom521]

...that the Russians "hacked" the DNC's e-mails. (We still don't know this for sure, but let's assume they did)

OK, their argument is that they (Russians) did it to influence or change the election results to Trump right? (As if they knew Clinton would've won otherwise?)

Fine. How did they know this? Most importantly, what was it in the actual e-mails that convinced them would change everyone's minds from Clinton in favor of Trump?

See, this is what I still don't hear anyone on the Left defending, that what was actually in those leaked e-mail leaks was all "made up"! Not even the victims (Podesta et all etc) are denying that the corruption, bigotry, viciousness, and arguably illegal activities the Dems were engaged in and revealed in those e mail leaks is all true. Yet the Dem Left isn't upset about any of that... oh no....they're just pissed off that the Russians decided to leak all of this sewage in order to flip the election results to Trump. Unreal.

Moreover despite all of those leaks both the Dems and the mainstream News media that virtually ignored the revelations, kept insisting through their constantly biased polling that the election was in the bag for crooked Hillary!

If you really think about it, it's the most asinine, convoluted argument a Democratic supporter can make on all points. At the very least it shows the Russians were apparently a lot smarter than the Party that was asking us to trust the future of our country to it's leadership.

Glad we didn't buy their sales pitch.

1: The CIA said the Russians hacked the DNC. It's not like it's "just made up out of thin air", and an INVESTIGATION happens in order to discover the who, what, why.

2: The DNC and Podesta were the targets, so that pretty much BY DEFAULT says that the Democratic candidate was who they meant to affect. By affect, I mean as the emails are leaked periodically through the election, it keeps the campaign off message and unable to be aggressive in their tactics. I still think Clinton would have lost, but the emails and the FBI investigation kept her in the defensive. Again, it's not like BOTH campaigns were hacked (or at least the hacked information about both campaigns were not leaked). So I do think that indicates the party responsible wanted to hurt the Dems.

3: I don't think the party responsible knew exactly what would be in the emails, or if the information once discovered would affect voters choice. But they knew it would keep the off message. That's a very serious negative for a campaign. I think it's why Clinton had to avoid direct press contact at a high level, and when your opponent continuously makes vague and unpopular statements in the media....that's a really big disadvantage. The one major drawback to Clinton was the perception of corruption. The emails showed speeches at Goldman-Sachs and Wall Street (which confirmed that corruption in many minds). I think that was information the responsible party knew would be there on some level prior to the hack and sought it out.

4: I didn't see anything illegal in the emails at all. Corruption? I think assumptions can be made, and I was actually upset at learning how close Clinton was to big business. Bigotry? Well, it's not like Trump doesn't have people with questionable personal opinions working with him. All of the information (including collusion ion with the media) doesn't make me think differently of Clinton (she's been inside most of her life...she's got some dirt for sure....so does Trump). There could very well be false information in those emails as well. Although, I think the campaign would have taken the time and effort to address those fabrications, if they did exist. But I am pissed the Russians are seemingly in favor of one candidate over the other, that concerns me....I would have been concerned if it was just the RNC and Conway that was hacked. It indicates POSSIBLE collusion between a candidate and a foreign state. Would that candidate be indebted to a foreign power? That's a serious question! Moreover, understanding the responsible party's motivations and capabilities is vital to protecting ourselves against even more dangerous hacks in the future. But all that aside....yes, I'm also pissed my girl lost with HELP from the Russian POS Putin (notice I didn't say she lost BECAUSE OF).

5: The information in the emails were covered. It ended Clintons career for sure. She couldn't win anything, anywhere. And I'm sure all polling procedures will be forever altered from this result. The weren't crooked, they were wrong, and polling will be approached differently going forward for sure. There is no way the "in the bag" attitude helped Clinton. It probably quelled dem turnout, and bolstered rep turnout.

6: You don't know that the RNC wasn't hacked as well. Be careful with all that tough talk about how the smarter party wouldn't allow this to happen....never know.

And you bought a different sales pitch my friend. Make no mistake

 

[Boomboom521]

I wish I could pack all of them into one of Elon Musk's Mars starships and shoot 'em off into deep interstellar space so they can all eventually set up their fantasy Utopia somewhere else in the middle of nowhere and leave the rest of us the Hell alone.

John Lennon used to "Imagine" no Country? Well "imagine" no Lefties?

Some day....people who say they love America but hate Americans like you....will be gone. The change you know is happening, I think, is what pisses conservatives off so much. Feel good about the next four though

 

[Boomboom521]

I wish I could pack all of them into one of Elon Musk's Mars starships and shoot 'em off into deep interstellar space so they can all eventually set up their fantasy Utopia somewhere else in the middle of nowhere and leave the rest of us the Hell alone.

John Lennon used to "Imagine" no Country? Well "imagine" no Lefties?

Don't dig on Lennon. The man was a genius

 

[countryroads89]

set up their fantasy Utopia somewhere else in the middle of nowhere and leave the rest of us the Hell alone.

No one is begging you to post here. It appears to me if you feel the way you say you do, this isn't the place for you.

 

[countryroads89]

...that the Russians "hacked" the DNC's e-mails. (We still don't know this for sure, but let's assume they did)

OK, their argument is that they (Russians) did it to influence or change the election results to Trump right? (As if they knew Clinton would've won otherwise?)

Both the CIA and FBI agree that Russia hacked the DNC's e-mails. They disagree on motive. The CIA has reached the conclusion that the motive was to influence the election in favor of Trump. No one is saying that Hillary would have won otherwise. You can make a claim that a particular group intended to influence a result, regardless of expectations of result if no influences were made. The FBI has not reached that conclusion. There is an ongoing investigation. Let's let it play out and discuss the conclusions when they have them and release them.

You really should become more informed.

 

[BombadEER]

He's alright now that he's got his pooh- pooh

 

[atlkvb]

You really should become more informed.

countryroads89 you missed the entire point of my post. Why are you more worried about the leaks than what was in them?

Get mad at the leaks if you want...it's a free country. However watching how you and the Left are virtually ignoring what was contained in those e mails is not only comical, but frightening.

 

[atlkvb]

No one is begging you to post here. It appears to me if you feel the way you say you do, this isn't the place for you.

It's their ideas we need to get rid of. If we can't do that at the ballot box, what's your solution?

 

[atlkvb]

Don't dig on Lennon. The man was a genius

Loved his music...hated that message! Imagine no Religion? We're not here by accident my friend!

 

[Boomboom521]

He's alright now that he's got his pooh- pooh

That's good! That's how you insult someone

 

[countryroads89]

Loved his music...hated that message! Imagine no Religion? We're not here by accident my friend!

Some of us don't believe in God (had enough respect to capitalize it). That is our right. Get over it.

 

[Boomboom521]

Loved his music...hated that message! Imagine no Religion? We're not here by accident my friend!

Organized religion is what he was referring to, in my opinion, I believe in energy. I would never knock someone for their religious views, but you got to admit it draws some pretty fierce lines between people. The song is about those lines dissolving and we all come together....positive energy.

 

[atlkvb]

1: The CIA said the Russians hacked the DNC. It's not like it's "just made up out of thin air", and an INVESTIGATION happens in order to discover the who, what, why.

2: The DNC and Podesta were the targets, so that pretty much BY DEFAULT says that the Democratic candidate was who they meant to affect. By affect, I mean as the emails are leaked periodically through the election, it keeps the campaign off message and unable to be aggressive in their tactics. I still think Clinton would have lost, but the emails and the FBI investigation kept her in the defensive. Again, it's not like BOTH campaigns were hacked (or at least the hacked information about both campaigns were not leaked). So I do think that indicates the party responsible wanted to hurt the Dems.

3: I don't think the party responsible knew exactly what would be in the emails, or if the information once discovered would affect voters choice. But they knew it would keep the off message. That's a very serious negative for a campaign. I think it's why Clinton had to avoid direct press contact at a high level, and when your opponent continuously makes vague and unpopular statements in the media....that's a really big disadvantage. The one major drawback to Clinton was the perception of corruption. The emails showed speeches at Goldman-Sachs and Wall Street (which confirmed that corruption in many minds). I think that was information the responsible party knew would be there on some level prior to the hack and sought it out.

4: I didn't see anything illegal in the emails at all. Corruption? I think assumptions can be made, and I was actually upset at learning how close Clinton was to big business. Bigotry? Well, it's not like Trump doesn't have people with questionable personal opinions working with him. All of the information (including collusion ion with the media) doesn't make me think differently of Clinton (she's been inside most of her life...she's got some dirt for sure....so does Trump). There could very well be false information in those emails as well. Although, I think the campaign would have taken the time and effort to address those fabrications, if they did exist. But I am pissed the Russians are seemingly in favor of one candidate over the other, that concerns me....I would have been concerned if it was just the RNC and Conway that was hacked. It indicates POSSIBLE collusion between a candidate and a foreign state. Would that candidate be indebted to a foreign power? That's a serious question! Moreover, understanding the responsible party's motivations and capabilities is vital to protecting ourselves against even more dangerous hacks in the future. But all that aside....yes, I'm also pissed my girl lost with HELP from the Russian POS Putin (notice I didn't say she lost BECAUSE OF).

5: The information in the emails were covered. It ended Clintons career for sure. She couldn't win anything, anywhere. And I'm sure all polling procedures will be forever altered from this result. The weren't crooked, they were wrong, and polling will be approached differently going forward for sure. There is no way the "in the bag" attitude helped Clinton. It probably quelled dem turnout, and bolstered rep turnout.

6: You don't know that the RNC wasn't hacked as well. Be careful with all that tough talk about how the smarter party wouldn't allow this to happen....never know.

And you bought a different sales pitch my friend. Make no mistake

In this entire response you proved my point. You're more upset THAT the e-mails were hacked (whoever did it) rather than what was in them.

That's not only funny, but frightening.

Let's say you supported Bernie Sanders, and really thought his State sponsored Government controlled Democratic Socialism is what was needed to "save" the country? You're happy with how your own Democratic party treated him and the entire primary process according to what was revealed in those e-mails?

You actually think those e-mails proved it was a fair fight and not rigged from the start to assure Clinton's nomination?

Again you're scary Man, as well as folks who think like you!

 

[atlkvb]

Some of us don't believe in God (had enough respect to capitalize it). That is our right. Get over it.

Hey you can not believe in the Sun too my friend, doesn't change that it's still there.

 

[WVPATX]

The OP makes a great point. Did the Russians tell Hillary to not even make one visit to WI? Did the Russians tell Hillary call half of Trump's supporters deplorables and irredeemable? Did the Russians tell Hillary's campaign to embrace Obama and run as essentially his third term, in what everyone knew was a change election (Why did Bernie Sanders do so well if Obama's third term was welcomed by Americans)? Did the Russians tell Hillary to set up a private server containing classified information and then to destroy 30,000 emails and also destroy servers and lap tops with hammers (Yes, innocent people do this all the time)? Did the Russians tell Hillary to accept hundreds of millions of dollars for her Foundation only to later get important meetings set up with State? Did the Russians make Hillary so untrustworthy based on polling of the American people? Did the Russians tell Hillary to lie repeatedly to the American people? Did the Russians tell Hillary to blame the video for Benghazi and then tell the families the video was responsible?

Trump was a horrible candidate. Hillary was a horrible candidate. It was a change election. Trump focused like a laser on our economy. Hillary did not. Hillary lost because of Hillary, not because of leaked emails from the DNC and Podesta.

 

[atlkvb]

Organized religion is what he was referring to, in my opinion, I believe in energy. I would never knock someone for their religious views, but you got to admit it draws some pretty fierce lines between people. The song is about those lines dissolving and we all come together....positive energy.

I think we're already joined by that energy you speak of. We share this Planet, we're all created uniquely on it, and we all have our responsibilities to Life because of it.

The question is do we respect that gift, or assume arrogance unto ourselves to destroy it?

 

[bornaneer]

Don't dig on Lennon. The man was a genius

LMAO......and we wonder why this country is so fuked up.

 

[atlkvb]

Trump was a horrible candidate. Hillary was a horrible candidate. It was a change election. Trump focused like a laser on our economy. Hillary did not. Hillary lost because of Hillary, not because of leaked emails from the DNC and Podesta.

Bingo. Not even Democrats trying to search for or create other reasons can get around this fact.

 

[countryroads89]

In this entire response you proved my point. You're more upset THAT the e-mails were hacked (whoever did it) rather than what was in them.

That's not only funny, but frightening.

Let's say you supported Bernie Sanders, and really thought his State sponsored Government controlled Democratic Socialism is what was needed to "save" the country? You're happy with how your own Democratic party treat him and the entire primary process according to what was revealed in those e-mails?

You actually think those e-mails proved it was a fair fight and not rigged from the start to assure Clinton's nomination?

Again you're scary Man, as well as folks who think like you!

I am a Bernie supporter. I don't like Hillary. I voted for her over Trump, make no mistake about it.

Right now, I am more concerned about the fact that hacking happened and we need to get to the bottom of it. I remember Paul Ryan and other Republicans saying that Republicans need to also condemn any type of external interference in our election process. That is clearly the bigger issue. The content can be dealt with later. I'm sure there are right wingers on this board that agree with that.

 

[atlkvb]

I am more concerned about the fact that hacking happened and we need to get to the bottom of it.

This is what really scares me about you folks on the Left.

If what you say is true, that you supported Bernie Sanders, you should be thanking the Russians or whoever hacked those e-mails for leaking the damaging information that was contained in them because it showed the very Democratic process you were participating in to get your man elected (Sanders) was rigged against your vote from the start!

Essentially, you were wasting your time and your vote for Sanders. The e-mails showed the Democrats arranged it to make sure he never had a chance.

And you're upset that the Russians (or whoever) leaked that information about how little your voice was respected in this entire process?

You're mad at Trump?

Really?

 

[TarHeelEer]

Republicans need to also condemn any type of external interference in our election process. That is clearly the bigger issue. The content can be dealt with later. I'm sure there are right wingers on this board that agree with that.

How dare they give Russian state money to Trump to oust Hillary. Oh wait, that was Obama with Israel. LINK
How dare Trump accept millions of dollars from external countries that all but dries up now that he lost. Oh wait, that was Hillary.

All whomever the hackers were did was expose what was happening behind closed doors. They didn't provide material directly to Trump. Podesta and other DNC officials fell for phishing variants. They did it to themselves.

I don't care the order, but it should all wait until after the Electoral College finishes their job. Otherwise the Democrats and those pushing for action now are the one's desecrating our electoral process.

 

[countryroads89]

This is what really scares me about you folks on the Left.

If what you say is true, that you supported Bernie Sanders, you should be thanking the Russians or whoever hacked those e-mails for leaking the damaging information that was contained in them because it showed the very Democratic process you were participating in to get your man elected (Sanders) was rigged against your vote from the start!

Essentially, you were wasting your time and your vote for Sanders. The e-mails showed the Democrats arranged it to make sure he never had a chance.

And you're upset that the Russians (or whoever) leaked that information about how little your voice was respected in this entire process?

You're mad at Trump?

Really?

The only anger that I have at Trump is for dismissing the fact that two intelligence agencies have said that hacking by a foreign government has happened, which is exactly what you are doing.

Your logic is fatally flawed. The DNC and Hillary colluding is another matter that should be dealt with, but it isn't reason to be dismissive of another government/country interfering with our election process.

Good lort!

 

[atlkvb]

The only anger that I have at Trump is for dismissing the fact that two intelligence agencies have said that hacking by a foreign government has happened, which is exactly what you are doing.

First of all he hasn't said that. He said we don't really know who was behind it or why?

Secondly, again you're more upset that we were "hacked" no matter who did it, rather than what they "Dems" were actually doing to subvert and corrupt our entire election process!

That doesn't get a rise out of you, but only the Russians maybe hacking those e-mail showing how the Dems were attempting to rig the election has you ready to call for a recount!

Unreal.

 

[Boomboom521]

Hey you can not believe in the Sun too my friend, doesn't change that it's still there.

That's about as dumb a response as I've ever read

 

[atlkvb]

That's about as dumb a response as I've ever read

What that there is still a Sun even though you can choose not to believe it, or that there is a Creator who put it there even though you think it just suddenly "appeared" there by accident since you choose not to believe in a Creator?

 

[Boomboom521]

First of all he hasn't said that. He said we don't really know who was behind it or why?

Secondly, again you're more upset that we were "hacked" no matter who did it, rather than what they "Dems" were actually doing to subvert and corrupt our entire election process!

That doesn't get a rise out of you, but only the Russians maybe hacking those e-mail showing how the Dems were attempting to rig the election has you ready to call for a recount!

Unreal.

I think we're already joined by that energy you speak of. We share this Planet, we're all created uniquely on it, and we all have our responsibilities to Life because of it.

The question is do we respect that gift, or assume arrogance unto ourselves to destroy it?

Do you seriously not see the past decade of WAR caused by religious extremism? How about the "justified" death and attempts of genocide that religious ideology has been responsible for throughout history?

 

[Boomboom521]

What that there is still a Sun even though you can choose not to believe it, or that there is a Creator who put it there even though you think it just suddenly "appeared" there by accident since you choose not to believe in a Creator?

You haven't a clue what my spirituality entails my friend, just because I don't believe in your bearded, all knowing, spiteful, "creator" don't think that you know. It's not one or the other

 

[TarHeelEer]

Do you seriously not see the past decade of WAR caused by religious extremism? How about the "justified" death and attempts of genocide that religious ideology has been responsible for throughout history?

Christian/Islam, Bible/Quran, Freedom/ConvertOrDie, Been There/Done That

 

[Boomboom521]

LMAO......and we wonder why this country is so fuked up.

Do you have any idea of the musical composition complexities of Strawberry Fields? Don't appreciate the genius of art?

 

[atlkvb]

Do you seriously not see the past decade of WAR caused by religious extremism? How about the "justified" death and attempts of genocide that religious ideology has been responsible for throughout history?

What "Religion" was Nazism, Communism my friend? In the 20th Century, more people died or were killed under those forms of man made Government run tyranny against Freedom than any Religion during the same period.

Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao, Hitler? What "Religion" were those guys? They murdered scores of Millions of their own people!

For what?

 

[Boomboom521]

Christian/Islam, Bible/Quran, Freedom/ConvertOrDie, Been There/Done That

Then read another thread

 

[roadtrasheer]

having a religion is as dumb as belonging to a political party

 

[Boomboom521]

In this entire response you proved my point. You're more upset THAT the e-mails were hacked (whoever did it) rather than what was in them.

That's not only funny, but frightening.

Let's say you supported Bernie Sanders, and really thought his State sponsored Government controlled Democratic Socialism is what was needed to "save" the country? You're happy with how your own Democratic party treated him and the entire primary process according to what was revealed in those e-mails?

You actually think those e-mails proved it was a fair fight and not rigged from the start to assure Clinton's nomination?

Again you're scary Man, as well as folks who think like you!

Do you really think there isn't corruption in Donald Trump? I said....Hillary has dirt on her hands....I even said that the emails upset me because I thought she wasn't as close to big business as they revealed..,..but you don't listen to any of that. You just see what you want, in the hacking issue, in my response to your thread, in Democrats, in the liberal cause, in Donald Trump.....you mold truth into a comforting narrative. Jesus and America and Trump versus all that I don't care about, so you can make more money too I bet.

 

[atlkvb]

You haven't a clue what my spirituality entails my friend, just because I don't believe in your bearded, all knowing, spiteful, "creator" don't think that you know. It's not one or the other

This is True. It is though a matter of what you believe. What your Faith is or what it's in?

I'm not questioning either.

Someone in this thread called me "dumb" because I stated that we are not here by accident, & I got attacked for commenting on Lennon's "Imagine" song wondering what it would be like with no Religion?

Folks can believe what they want, it doesn't change what is though. That is all I said or the only point I was trying to make.

 

[atlkvb]

Do you really think there isn't corruption in Donald Trump? I said....Hillary has dirt on her hands....I even said that the emails upset me because I thought she wasn't as close to big business as they revealed..,..but you don't listen to any of that. You just see what you want, in the hacking issue, in my response to your thread, in Democrats, in the liberal cause, in Donald Trump.....you mold truth into a comforting narrative. Jesus and America and Trump versus all that I don't care about, so you can make more money too I bet.

You continue to prove my point because you really don't care that your vote for Sanders was stolen from you by the very Democratic party you support. That doesn't bother you...only the Russians hacking e-mails, and Trump (for whatever reason)

 

[Airport]

Don't dig on Lennon. The man was a genius

Listen to song Imagine, it doesn't work. People are not going to share their stuff with people who sit around doing nothing. People will always protect their stuff. Jamestown settlement, people were given land to produce goods and then bring to market to share. Guess what? Some didn't do anything but wanted to share in what others had produced. Sound familiar? That set up only lasted one year.