Getting interesting. Nunes: Trump transition team under surveillance

[WVPATX]

Correct me if I'm wrong but a law enforcement agency can get a warrant to wiretap any American they please, if sufficient evidence is presented to constitute the warrant? So.....I really don't understand what was wrong with the incidental collection.

The leaks? Sure....bust em....lock them up. I wouldn't argue against it. I just know without leaks, many wrongdoings in DC wouldn't be uncovered.

A FISA warrant and a criminal warrant obviously are two different warrants. FISA deals with national security and terrorism. Probable cause is not required to get a FISA warrant unlike a criminal warrant. But if you pick up an American under FISA surveillance, the name must be protected and remain so. It is frequently required that the entire conversation of the American be redacted from the transcript. In fact, I do not believe the name can be disseminated to any other intelligence agency.

In a criminal warrant, obviously probable cause is required before a judge will issue that warrant. I am not an attorney so I do not know the rules of disclosure regarding the participants in that wire tap if one of the principles in that conversation is completely innocent.

 

[WVPATX]

It's sounding like someone in the prior administration thought it would be a slam dunk that Trump was a traitor, and they were going to go to all lengths to ensure he was nailed. The Republican Party would go down with him. Well, it's not looking like as much of a slam dunk anymore, and someone is going to get caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

I am very skeptical that the Leakers will get caught. I am also very skeptical that the entire story of this matter will come out. I simply don't trust the agencies involved.

 

[atlkvb]

It's sounding like someone in the prior administration thought it would be a slam dunk that Trump was a traitor, and they were going to go to all lengths to ensure he was nailed. The Republican Party would go down with him. Well, it's not looking like as much of a slam dunk anymore, and someone is going to get caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

I am really anxious to know who ordered espionage on a major American political figure trying to frame him for attempting to undermine our election process with a Foreign adversary?

What's the crime for whoever cooked up that scheme?

 

[TarHeelEer]

I am really anxious to know who ordered espionage on a major American political figure trying to frame him for attempting to undermine our election process with a Foreign adversary?

What's the crime for whoever cooked up that scheme?

I wouldn't know, but can't be good. Not ready to say this is the case, but it smells like it.

 

[atlkvb]

if you pick up an American under FISA surveillance, the name must be protected and remain so. It is frequently required that the entire conversation of the American be redacted from the transcript. In fact, I do not believe the name can be disseminated to any other intelligence agency.

This is the heart of the Law, and the heart of the willful violation of it in this particular case. Where is the Media's "outrage" over this blatant disregard for our Laws and privacy?

Crickets.

 

[atlkvb]

Nunes statement:

Nunes: “I recently confirmed that on numerous occasions the intelligence community incidentally collected information about U.S. citizens involved in the Trump transition. Details about U.S. persons associated with the incoming administration details with little or no apparent foreign intelligence value were widely disseminated in intelligence community reporting.

Third, I have confirmed that additional names of Trump transition team members were unmasked.

And fourth and finally I want to be clear, none of this surveillance was related to Russia or the investigation of Russian activities or of the Trump team.”

Now we know why the Obama administration signed that order just 14 days before leaving office whoch permitted raw intelligence to be shared with 15 other agencies greatly increasing the likelihood of leaks and the unmasking of innocent Americans.

Unreal

 

[Boomboom521]

What does that have to do with the liberal political landscape of today? Hillary's non-secure server with classified documents on it? No big deal. Someone leaking out opposition intelligence with names on it, breaking half the bill of rights? who cares. It doesn't matter, as long as we win the political game.

I don't know.....it's not a passionate thought of mine, because I have children I want protected.....but I do think people in government (both sides) have gotten away with too much for too long. I've seen corruption in the House first hand, and the meme we was ranking member on the ethics committee. But I admit, in this situation, my hate and distrust for Trump does bias my thoughts on it

 

[atlkvb]

It was part of a LEGAL INVESTIGATION.

That's not what the Senate Intelligence committee Chairman told the media today. He said that "none of this surveillance was related to Russia or the investigation of Russian activities or of the Trump team.”

So what were they snooping on Trump Tower for boom?

(and who ordered it?)

 

[atlkvb]

I am very skeptical that the Lakers will get caught. I am also very skeptical that the entire story of this matter will come out. I simply don't trust the agencies involved.

I trust investigators to find out the Truth, but I agree with you it will be covered up by either someone in Government or the Media. We may never find out the whole story because of all the corruption that has to be protected.

So expect more "lies with the Truth" as the Media reluctantly reveals the details of what is known or discovered about this illegality.

It's corrupt people inside the Government protecting itself with the help of a Media that adores big Government. Why expect accountability from any part of that unholy triumvirate?

 

[PriddyBoy]

You know, TH, as much as you.....and PATX and dave and Priddy and bornan and DvlDog and the other jackboots down there fighting for the single seat at the very top of the rightfield foul pole.....continuously claim to dislike/disrespect/whatever Trump, it's borderline amazing how much time (and how many posts) you spend defending him with your cyber-lives..

Of course, as I've been saying for months now, there's nothing in your (and the others) lives more distasteful than playing defense.. At least the Left wingers around here never tried to hide their affection for their guy; aside neilmont and 82 (and maybe atl), you guys spend pretty much everyday of your lives around here trying to convince folks you don't like Trump.....while simultaneously wiping his ass every time each of you bend over.

Keep it up; it's really fun watching you guys dance a jig every time Trump opens his mouth.(or touches a keyboard, or picks up a smartphone).

I've never posted that I don't like Trump. I've thought about posting to ask why I shouldn't, but didn't want to hear hypocrisy about pussy grabbing. Face it, the guy's probably dodged more pookiaki than any of us have had. Yeah, I kind of like him, but didn't want to start another 'grown up' thread about orange hair and tiny hands and Nazis. We get enough of that childishness around here without my goading. I know what you're talking about with people saying they don't like him (to each his own) but I'll bet you any amount you can't find a post where I claimed any dislike. It shouldn't be too hard to find a post of my dislike for the Republican Party, whose platform is still 1000 times better than the Democratic wishy-washy nonsense. The Republicans may win me back yet, but they'll have to practice what they preach. If you really try, you could find a post where I predicted a Trump win the second he rode the escalator and announced his candidacy. This election was about an anti-establishment statement. I can't believe some people won't accept that. The f'n swamp is plumb full, that's why Trump is being fought from all sides of the aisle. He may have an impossible task and often doesn't help the cause, but one can hope.

Again, I get it about the 'dislike' comments, just exclude me from that group. Thantks.

 

[Boomboom521]

That's not what the Senate Intelligence committee Chairman told the media today. He said that "none of this surveillance was related to Russia or the investigation of Russian activities or of the Trump team.”

So what were they snooping on Trump Tower for boom?

(and who ordered it?)

He said it was incidental collection based on a legal investigation

 

[atlkvb]

This election was about an anti-establishment statement. I can't believe some people won't accept that. The f'n swamp is plumb full, that's why Trump is being fought from all sides of the aisle. He may have an impossible task and often doesn't help the cause, but one can hope.

Very few people understand this about him or this past election. This is 100% correct though, it was an electorate fed up with politicians in both parties, and Trump pissed off just as many establishment type Republicans as he did Leftist ideologues.

 

[atlkvb]

He said it was incidental collection based on a legal investigation

The information collected was part of a legal process unrelated to an ongoing investigation (of Trump's alleged ties to Russians)

There was no reason to violate the privacy of those caught up in that sweep, THAT'S what Nunes says bothers him. Why was Trump under surveillance, and who knew about it or ordered it?

 

[Boomboom521]

Russia aside (even though I do the no there is something very bad happening there)......Trumps still a horrible pick for President. His policies might make conservatives happy, and that's fine by me (it's OUR nation). But this man is not fit to be in that office, imo.

 

[atlkvb]

But this man is not fit to be in that office, imo.

I'd sure like to know what your criterion for measurement of that is boom? Are you speaking from a competence standpoint, an objective moral imperative, a subjective analysis of his governing acumen, a political philosophy?

Explain.

 

[Boomboom521]

I'd sure like to know what your criterion for measurement of that is boom? Are you speaking from a competence standpoint, an objective moral imperative, a subjective analysis of his governing acumen, a political philosophy?

Explain.

Anyone that doesn't have the patience to wait until investigations are completed. Anyone that doesn't have the self confidence to not attack two bit celebrities that say negative things about you. Anyone that doesn't have the decency to apologize (just apologize) when wrong while offending women, the handicapped, or a sitting President. Anyone who doesn't have the courage to stand by what they said and done in the face of ridicule or embarrassment. Should not be President. Say what you want about his policies: Obama was not a loudmouth jerk like our current President.

 

[bornaneer]

Trumps still a horrible pick for President.

LMAO....you can have Hillary.....hate to break it to you......she lost.

 

[atlkvb]

Anyone that doesn't have the patience to wait until investigations are completed

Is that why the Obama Administration didn't "force" those in the IRS investigation to testify instead of pleading the 5th and tell the Truth about who ordered their enhanced interrogations of Religious based 501(c) (3)s? Or Benghazi, or Fast & Furious, or the unauthorized raiding of Federal holdings of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae investments?

Anyone that doesn't have the self confidence to not attack two bit celebrities that say negative things about you.

Does that include Obama's attacks against Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Mark Levin, Alex Jones, or Fox News, or anyone else on the air on the Right who was critical of his policies?

Anyone that doesn't have the decency to apologize (just apologize) when wrong while offending women, the handicapped, or a sitting President.

Does that include Hillary Clinton accusing the Women who accused her husband of being a rapist, or abusive of a minor in the WH? She called them liars & "bimbos" and tried to discredit every one of them (while incidentally insisting that all rape allegations should be taken seriously) or Obama calling Bush "unpatriotic" for just 8 Trillion dollars of debt, or Obama calling some Cops "stupid"?

Anyone who doesn't have the courage to stand by what they said and done in the face of ridicule or embarrassment.

Does that include lying to the American people about a Terrorist attack in Benghazi, or the breakdown of the peace won in Iraq, or the phony "Red Line" drawn in the sand over Syria, or our famous Russian "reset" or our blatant back stabbing of Israel in the UN and the Middle East, or the blatant lies about our health care policies, and costs?

The Left thinks Obama was the greatest President we've ever had, and Hillary was his superior replacement. Did you disagree with any of them boomer that both were in fact "unfit" for Office by your own definitions for Trump?

What were your exceptions for them boomer?

 

[WVPATX]

He said it was incidental collection based on a legal investigation

Actually boom he said that he believed it to be legal but was going to collect more information. However, as we have talked about a lot. The dissemination and leaking of those names and transcripts is highly illegal.

He also said that Trump may have been right when he complained that the government ordered surveillance against him.

 

[WVPATX]

Anyone that doesn't have the patience to wait until investigations are completed. Anyone that doesn't have the self confidence to not attack two bit celebrities that say negative things about you. Anyone that doesn't have the decency to apologize (just apologize) when wrong while offending women, the handicapped, or a sitting President. Anyone who doesn't have the courage to stand by what they said and done in the face of ridicule or embarrassment. Should not be President. Say what you want about his policies: Obama was not a loudmouth jerk like our current President.

No, but Obama was an extraordinary liar, greatly damaged our foreign relations and did incredible damage to our economy. Policies matter much more than personality.

 

[atlkvb]

No, but Obama was an extraordinary liar, greatly damaged our foreign relations and did incredible damage to our economy. Policies matter much more than personality.

None of that qualifies for being "unqualified" apparently Pax.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

Deep state,

so if your crack dealer is wiretapped, and you call him asking for your daily rock fix. Did the DEA wiretap your house?

Or another analogy if you will:

You're a top flight surgeon in your city and one of your patients is a member of a drug cartel. He calls you to schedule an appointment.

2 weeks later, every news outlet in the country releases a story stating this:

"Local surgeon communicating with drug cartels. Is he funneling Mexican prescription pharmaceuticals , money laundering, or a front for MS-13's entire east coast distribution of Mexican black tar heroin"?

 

[atlkvb]

I mean just look at how the Left on this board is handling this latest spy news. Three or four weeks ago when Trump first made this allegation he was ridiculed as some sort of paranoid hypochondriac.

"Never happened"..."he's delusional"...they all barked. By that following weekend once it had been proven there was indeed a FISA warrant, and evidence of private conversations "intercepted"...but no proof of Trump's wires being "tapped"..."oh no, not true" the Left bellowed!

Then as more evidence emerged, it became clear that Trump was not under any criminal indictment or suspicion of 'colluding' with Russians to steal the election--and there was no evidence of such. The Left continued to insist Trump had colluded with the Russians, and the investigation would reveal it.

So now evidence emerges that Trump was indeed correct, and had been placed under some sort of surveillance...essentially validating his original charge and what does the Left say? "He's obstructing justice", or "trying to hide his role in the collusion with Russians" so he has co opted the Senate intelligence committee trying to head off their investigation of his ties to Russians.

Notice how each time their allegations of Trump's wrongdoing in fact confirmed his charges against their slipshod reporting they doubled down on their own false narratives against him? They never accepted what the evidence actually showed, only what they wanted you to either believe or what they thought it should show.

Pax has said these people (Media) are viciously corrupt, and he's correct. I say they are hopelessly incompetent and the proof of their behavior should convince you of that also.

The Left constantly buys into their hypnotic mind control so is it any wonder they are also so loopy and such comfortable companions of fiction instead of staunch allies with Truth?

 

[Boomboom521]

I mean just look at how the Left on this board is handling this latest spy news. Three or four weeks ago when Trump first made this allegation he was ridiculed as some sort of paranoid hypochondriac.

"Never happened"..."he's delusional"...they all barked. By that following weekend once it had been proven there was indeed a FISA warrant, and evidence of private conversations "intercepted"...but no proof of Trump's wires being "tapped"..."oh no, not true" the Left bellowed!

Then as more evidence emerged, it became clear that Trump was not under any criminal indictment or suspicion of 'colluding' with Russians to steal the election--and there was no evidence of such. The Left continued to insist Trump had colluded with the Russians, and the investigation would reveal it.

So now evidence emerges that Trump was indeed correct, and had been placed under some sort of surveillance...essentially validating his original charge and what does the Left say? "He's obstructing justice", or "trying to hide his role in the collusion with Russians" so he has co opted the Senate intelligence committee trying to head off their investigation of his ties to Russians.

Notice how each time their allegations of Trump's wrongdoing in fact confirmed his charges against their slipshod reporting they doubled down on their own false narratives against him? They never accepted what the evidence actually showed, only what they wanted you to either believe or what they thought it should show.

Pax has said these people (Media) are viciously corrupt, and he's correct. I say they are hopelessly incompetent and the proof of their behavior should convince you of that also.

The Left constantly buys into their hypnotic mind control so is it any wonder they are also so loopy and such comfortable companions of fiction instead of staunch allies with Truth?

But you sir have no evidence at all, yet. Only what conservatives say. Yet.....

 

[atlkvb]

But you sir have no evidence at all, yet. Only what conservatives say. Yet.....

You're right boom....I have no evidence Trump colluded with Russians or didn't, nor does anyone else. I do know Trump was under surveillance. You're right I don't know who, or why? I am also fairly convinced that the Media's reporting on this story has been mostly wrong, in fact dead wrong.

I'll wait and see where the hard evidence leads, but I'm more convinced than skeptical it has nothing to do with Trump and almost everything to do either Obama or his "deep State" sympathizers.

 

[countryroads89]

Actually boom he said that he believed it to be legal but was going to collect more information. However, as we have talked about a lot. The dissemination and leaking of those names and transcripts is highly illegal.

He also said that Trump may have been right when he complained that the government ordered surveillance against him.

Information collected on US citizens under FISA warrants can be kept for up to five years, disseminated among the intelligence agencies and can be used for purposes if illegal activity is believed to be occurring.

 

[countryroads89]

If calls from the tower were tapped, for whatever reason, by our government then Trump is right that Obama tapped them.

General Office of Counsel at NSA prepares the FISA warrant.

 

[WVPATX]

Information collected on US citizens under FISA warrants can be kept for up to five years, disseminated among the intelligence agencies and can be used for purposes if illegal activity is believed to be occurring.

That is one huge if. It is also illegal to unmask innocent Americans. And it is certainly illegal to leak any of this information to the media.

 

[Boomboom521]

You're right boom....I have no evidence Trump colluded with Russians or didn't, nor does anyone else. I do know Trump was under surveillance. You're right I don't know who, or why? I am also fairly convinced that the Media's reporting on this story has been mostly wrong, in fact dead wrong.

I'll wait and see where the hard evidence leads, but I'm more convinced than skeptical it has nothing to do with Trump and almost everything to do either Obama or his "deep State" sympathizers.

Sure. And no bias leads you to these theories? What's bs is you accuse the left of this shit, and yet you're guilty of it too. The ONLY things that lead me to my theory that Trump has something up with Russia are his own words, the actions of people very close to his campaign, and the fact that the man is a money hungry power junkie that has sleazed his way through the business world for decades.

 

[dave]

General Office of Counsel at NSA prepares the FISA warrant.

The NSA is an executive branch dept. Who works for the President.

 

[dave]

The ONLY things that lead me to my theory that Trump has something up with Russia is a media narrative that I have bought hook line and sinker

FIFY.

 

[WVU82]

the man is a money hungry power junkie that has sleazed his way through the business world for decades.

DJT just fell 208 places on Forbe's billionaire list...

He doesn't give a crap about personal wealth now...

He just wants to fix our country...

Thank God somebody cares about it...

 

[atlkvb]

Sure. And no bias leads you to these theories? What's bs is you accuse the left of this shit, and yet you're guilty of it too. The ONLY things that lead me to my theory that Trump has something up with Russia are his own words, the actions of people very close to his campaign, and the fact that the man is a money hungry power junkie that has sleazed his way through the business world for decades.

Honestly boomer (and no personal insult intended here, just an objective observation) what is 'BS' is the way you and so many others on the Left try to come off as these dispassionate unbiased observers of all that is real, and you pretend as if your thoughts and desires aren't colored by any bias and you're all totally open to allowing just the facts to speak for themselves?

Give me a break.

Yet here we have a brazen violation of both the spirit and the letter of the FISA statute, we have willful and negligent behavior on the part of Hillary Clinton and that illegal Private e-mail server she ran, we have obvious dishonesty and deceit in that Benghazi fiasco, and we have demonstrated malfeasance if not outright criminal behavior on the part of the DNC to disrupt and otherwise manipulate the election process both in the primaries and the general, and I have not seen one post in criticism from either you or anyone else on the Left of even one of those.

You try to set yourselves up as these neutral observers and/or pursuers of "just the facts" yet you all wallow in only suppositions and propositions of illegality regarding Trump...while totally ignoring gross violations of Law on your side.

Disingenuous is too kind of a word for the 'BS' coming from the Left on any of this boomer, and quite frankly your charges suggesting a "bias" on my part because of ideology is not only comical it is downright nauseating coming from someone such as yourself who not only looks the other way on Leftist ideological corruption, but your head turns on a complete 360 degree swivel! (Exorcist style)

 

[countryroads89]

DJT just fell 208 places on Forbe's billionaire list...

He doesn't give a crap about personal wealth now...

He just wants to fix our country...

Thank God somebody cares about it...

And the middle class' taxes are going to be reduced.