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Stop self-medicating, morons!

Think about car dealerships. Most are leveraged to the hilt with their floor plans. I’m sure they are working out deals with their lenders. But what about the salesmen? Most have minimal draws.

But I thought the liberal media was in China’s hip pocket as well? You just contradicted yourself with the article you pinned. I’m a conservative guys but some of this stuff is a little much. Crack down on China’s ass. Hell yes! Evaluate our supply chains. Absolutely! Saying they control our media. Cmon!
 
Trump needs to tear into congress at his press conference. Like a 5 minute rant just laying them out for putting all this bullshit in the financial bill. And it is from both sides of the aisle. My favorite is the pay increase for Congress. The kennedy center money is shit too. There is all kinds of special interest crap in there which is just a disgrace. Trump needs to publicly rip them to pieces and tell them if it isn’t directly related to repairing the damage to the economy from this, he will veto the bill.

His popularity would soar.
Trump supports this: https://thehill.com/homenews/admini...lion-in-kennedy-center-funding-in-coronavirus
 
How? Something tells me you were singing a different tune during the previous impeachment. :rolleyes:

Nope, it was bullshit then too. And just like this time, everybody knew it was going nowhere in the Senate. A complete waste of time, especially now when we clearly had more urgent issues around the world to pay attention to.

That "something" which told you that is either woman's intuition, or just hoping others are as petty as you playing partisan games.

As for the rest...I'm just proud that less than 20 of my words sent you into a lengthy tirade. lol!
 
Me coming back into this thread after realizing it is 7 pages:
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This thing has gone so far off the rails I don't even remember what it was about. Oh yeah, fish tank cleaners cures coronavirus. I think that's right... isn't it? Maybe not? Oh well!
 
This thing has gone so far off the rails I don't even remember what it was about. Oh yeah, fish tank cleaners cures coronavirus. I think that's right... isn't it? Maybe not? Oh well!

Apparently there’s only one way to find out.
 
I know and he is wrong. How many hundreds of small restaurants would that $25 million keep afloat during this time? How many thousands of employees would be helped?
Most small restaurants in my area, which is most of the restaurants, are offering take-out and the community is supporting it. We are doing Take-Out Tuesday; everyone that would normally go out once a week orders in for Tuesday. My wife and I did it Tuesday and Thursday.

My wife is part of the food/restaurant supply chain and they and their partners, the food distributors, are hurting. Layoff in the distribution area are in the thousands at just one of her larger national customers.

So instead of bitching about it, order in on Tuesday and Thursday; one day for the mom & pop joint and one day for the chains. Don't forget, just because the chain restaurant is owned by some big corporation, the people that work there are your neighbors. Tip well also!
 
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But I thought the liberal media was in China’s hip pocket as well? You just contradicted yourself with the article you pinned. I’m a conservative guys but some of this stuff is a little much. Crack down on China’s ass. Hell yes! Evaluate our supply chains. Absolutely! Saying they control our media. Cmon!
I didn’t say they control the media. I posted an article that says they influence Bloomberg views and his network’s reporting.
 
This thing has gone so far off the rails I don't even remember what it was about. Oh yeah, fish tank cleaners cures coronavirus. I think that's right... isn't it? Maybe not? Oh well!
We're all social distancing. This thread is whatever we make it to be at this point.

Let's make fun of Myrtle Beach now!
 
We're all social distancing. This thread is whatever we make it to be at this point.

Let's make fun of Myrtle Beach now!
I like Myrtle Beach but my wife hates it, not upscale enough for her. I think it stems from a last minute trip I put together for us and accommodations were less than optimum. Good golf though and nice beach.

Same trip they opened the new civic center performance space. Opening act: Bill Cosby...oops!
 
Yep, and this is why:

You read that as a hit piece on him when the dumb shit literally mentioned it could be used against COVID19. Someone end this post-fact reality already...



Please tell me you’re kidding. Did you actually vote for Hillary Clinton while living in “coal country”.

Drinking fish tank chemicals doesn’t sound dangerous to you? You need the President to tell you to do that or not to do that. You libs are the worst.
 
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@WVUPharm2007

I missed your updates on the latest developments as to this treatment. Please link me to your posts presenting these stories so we can all see that you are truly Independent here. Thanks.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/29/fda-emergency-authorization-anti-malaria-drug-155095

https://techstartups.com/2020/03/28...hydroxychloroquine-sulfate-zinc-z-pak-update/

I really don't understand how a successful treatment for the biggest global pandemic of the last century becomes politicized. But here we are.

Is any of this conclusive that we have a confirmed cure? No.

Is it reason for optimism? Yes.

Should more people read these stories than the fish tank cleaner garbage you were peddling on here last week? Also yes.

You guys need to do some internal reflection over this issue. Every single person in this country, if not the world, should be cheering on the success of these treatments. I honestly don't even understand how that's a controversial stance.
 
@WVUPharm2007

I missed your updates on the latest developments as to this treatment. Please link me to your posts presenting these stories so we can all see that you are truly Independent here. Thanks.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/29/fda-emergency-authorization-anti-malaria-drug-155095

https://techstartups.com/2020/03/28...hydroxychloroquine-sulfate-zinc-z-pak-update/

I really don't understand how a successful treatment for the biggest global pandemic of the last century becomes politicized. But here we are.

Is any of this conclusive that we have a confirmed cure? No.

Is it reason for optimism? Yes.

Should more people read these stories than the fish tank cleaner garbage you were peddling on here last week? Also yes.

You guys need to do some internal reflection over this issue. Every single person in this country, if not the world, should be cheering on the success of these treatments. I honestly don't even understand how that's a controversial stance.

First thing first, I wasn't "peddling" the fish tank consumption story. Someone else brought it up and I chimed in with facts. Please stop insisting that I'm interested in political squabbles. I get that you are probably the type of person that engages in political arguments online and the only way you can process things is "us vs them." However, I have little interest in this being that most political tribalists are very poor are making rational conclusions. Conservatives will naturally be biased against things that are bad for Trump. Liberals are going to be biased against things that are good for Trump. We need sober thoughts based on high quality evidence. It would be awesome if the cocktail of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin were highly effective against COVID-19. We just need to base conclusions off of high quality evidence and not small, weak case studies.

It's good that the FDA approved use. Physicians need to be given every tool in the toolbox. Though, to be fair, it didn't actually have to be approved. Physicians could use the drug off-label at any time. And they have been using HCQ + AZM in many cases around the world when deemed by the physician as appropriate. It should be warned, however, that the FDA clearly noted that there is no definitive proof of the medication working. Which is, in fact, still the case. We are still working on a true double blind study to see if HCQ +AZM is as effective as the French case study or as ineffective (HCQ only) as in the Chinese case study. The same can be said for other drugs, too. There is an emerging thought that melatonin might be a good supplement to treatment. Again, this, too is questionable and has little evidence to back it up.

The Zelenko fellow's results aren't a true test of the effectiveness of HCQ. He didn't actually test his patients for being COVID-19 positive, so we have no idea how many, if any of them at all, were infected. He simply gave a large group of people the cocktail and none of them died. This is why a true double blind of confirmed patients is needed. We have no idea if his results are indicative of anything.

Laymen should let the professionals guide the decisions about their care.. The best infectious disease minds in the world are tackling this problem. The best prescription right now is staying home, washing your hands, and protecting yourself from infection.
 
I wish you had an ounce of self-awareness to understand that you have injected more "political tribalism" into this debate than anyone other than OP.

You lack maturity on this issue. Honestly, you sound like a student in PoliSci 101 at some community college who thinks he discovered this revolutionary apolitical worldview where he is truly unbiased, independent, and it's everyone else who brings up politics when he's lecturing them about their "political tribalism."

You sound ridiculous.

Biases are not new. Nor are they unique to politics. Everyone has them. Some biases are bad, but most are normal human behavior. Want to know a secret? You have them, too. You're just refusing to put yours out there. Not because you're truly independent. But because you believe your bias gives you access to a pedestal from which you can lecture all the political tribalists about how backward they are.

And if you need any evidence as to why "laymen" may be reluctant to blindly trust the surely apolitical "professionals" on this issue, your posts in this thread can be Exhibit A.

Let's hope for a cure. Let's also stop lecturing people who hope.
 
I wish you had an ounce of self-awareness to understand that you have injected more "political tribalism" into this debate than anyone other than OP.

You lack maturity on this issue. Honestly, you sound like a student in PoliSci 101 at some community college who thinks he discovered this revolutionary apolitical worldview where he is truly unbiased, independent, and it's everyone else who brings up politics when he's lecturing them about their "political tribalism."

You sound ridiculous.

Biases are not new. Nor are they unique to politics. Everyone has them. Some biases are bad, but most are normal human behavior. Want to know a secret? You have them, too. You're just refusing to put yours out there. Not because you're truly independent. But because you believe your bias gives you access to a pedestal from which you can lecture all the political tribalists about how backward they are.

And if you need any evidence as to why "laymen" may be reluctant to blindly trust the surely apolitical "professionals" on this issue, your posts in this thread can be Exhibit A.

Let's hope for a cure. Let's also stop lecturing people who hope.

Cool. You want to discuss the science any more I'm here. Just @ me.
 
Cool. You want to discuss the science any more I'm here. Just @ me.

@WVUPharm2007

What are the risks with proceeding with a treatment/cure like this that has not been fully vetted like a traditional medication would?

As I see it, these drugs are themselves not new. So their side effects are already generally known. A patient, under a doctor's supervision and care, can therefore make an informed choice as to whether the risk of side effects justifies the treatment. So am I correct that for this particular treatment the real risk for a patient who tries it is that it simply won't work?
 
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I wish you had an ounce of self-awareness to understand that you have injected more "political tribalism" into this debate than anyone other than OP.

You lack maturity on this issue. Honestly, you sound like a student in PoliSci 101 at some community college who thinks he discovered this revolutionary apolitical worldview where he is truly unbiased, independent, and it's everyone else who brings up politics when he's lecturing them about their "political tribalism."

You sound ridiculous.

Biases are not new. Nor are they unique to politics. Everyone has them. Some biases are bad, but most are normal human behavior. Want to know a secret? You have them, too. You're just refusing to put yours out there. Not because you're truly independent. But because you believe your bias gives you access to a pedestal from which you can lecture all the political tribalists about how backward they are.

And if you need any evidence as to why "laymen" may be reluctant to blindly trust the surely apolitical "professionals" on this issue, your posts in this thread can be Exhibit A.

Let's hope for a cure. Let's also stop lecturing people who hope.

LMAO.

Your trump bleeding pussy is showing through your white pants.

trumpers don't realize they are stupid. It's hilarious.
 
What are the risks with proceeding with a treatment/cure like this that has not been fully vetted like a traditional medication would?

As I see it, these drugs are themselves not new. So their side effects are already generally known. A patient, under a doctor's supervision and care, can therefore make an informed choice as to whether the risk of side effects justifies the treatment. So am I correct that for this particular treatment the real risk for a patient who tries it is that it simply won't work?

Well, a few things.

There is a small chance of inducing a prolonged QT interval in some patients. I actually did some research on this and concluded that the increase in QTc is likely very, very small and unlikely to affect many. Pfizer did a study that found it was less likely less than 10ms, which is generally not a concern. But it is something to keep in mind. On a national scale, it may kill some patients.

Also, publicly announcing that a potential cure has created a rush on HCQ. It is on backorder and impossible to get right now. There are patients that have Lupus and other autoimmune diseases that literally need this drug to live. Many can't find it now because a whole lot of people panic purchased a prescription several weeks ago. Multiple companies have increased production, so hopefully the shortages are only transient.

But your entire point here is kind of moot. Researchers and physicians knew about this long before the president did or the general public did. If you look through my posts, I mentioned that the most interesting theories are using either an ARB like losartan (this went nowhere) or hydroxychloroquine (this has some potential) back in February or early March. And the cutting edge researchers knew about the potential way before me. It's not like they aren't using these meds in some cases and are waiting for the FDA to give formal approval. Critical care docs are already using it and have been using it. And patients on HCQ are still dying at an alarming rate.

I know a few ID specialist and crit care specialist pharmacists and they aren't really that convinced it is as effective as more sensational reports have described it as being - though it may have some limited benefit. I pretty much parrot what they are saying - we still don't know if it is effective or not. And if so, how effective. So don't get your hopes up, but it might be an option for physicians.

As an aside, the pros I've spoken to are more behind the use of plasma from recovered patients. An article in JAMA detailed a case study: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2763983

But I have to stress, much like HCQ, we don't know if or how effective it will be.
 
NYU internal medicine physician that is in the middle of this mess giving interesting insight. Click on the datestamp below and read the entire thread chain:

 
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Interesting. Definitely not the expected results considering what other studies have shown. Looks like the AZM + HCQ wing did very poorly and only HCQ alone appeared to help. This goes against a few other study that concluded that it did nothing and one that concluded that it harmed patients. As well as the original case study by the French physician that showed AZM + HCQ was far superior to control and HCQ alone. I'd caution that it still looks inconclusive, though. The Oxford trial was larger and had vastly different results. There appears to be a lot of contradictory evidence. But perhaps further study may be warranted afterall. Perhaps there may be situational utility for the drug in some patients. We have to wait for the evidence to continue to mount.

Edit: I read the study and the peer review.

One important thing was noted by a reviewer of the study: https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30530-0/fulltext#

Finally, concomitant steroid use in patients receiving hydroxychloroquine was more than double the non-treated group. This is relevant considering the recent RECOVERY trial that showed a mortality benefit with dexamethasone among individuals requiring supplemental oxygen or mechanical ventilation, potentially biasing this study’s results in favor of hydroxychloroquine.

Given the results of the study published a few weeks ago that steroid use can drastically reduce mortality, this makes one wonder if the decrease in mortality was due to HCQ, the steroid, or the combination of both.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the study goes in the trash bin. All data is good data. But now we have to figure out how much the addition of steroids to an overwhelming percentage of HCQ patients is biasing the results. It would be awesome if HCQ worked as well as the headline of the study is claiming.

Edit 2: It also was a retrospective analysis and not a clinical trial. This doesn't mean the data is no good! It just means that it is a lower quality of evidence than a proper controlled trial.
 
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Stupid people are so partisan they will do and say anything—even at a time when most people realize now is not the time—to try to blame political opponents for every misfortune in the news. The inspiring silver lining in this black Coronavirus cloud is the unity this moment is bringing. Stupid people can’t wait to get back to partisan bickering and congressional gridlock.
Stupid people on both sides of the aisle use partisan bickering in effort to stick with their line of thinking. WE THE PEOPLE allowed that to happen and continue to let it happen. It could not be better said than with Denzil Washington's Line in "Glory". "We are all in it and it stinks".
 
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