See what happens when they don't listen to me

[5150]

A) Hindsight arguments make me lol!

B) Penn St went 2-3 against ranked opponents this year.

Meanwhile OSU went 3-2 against ranked opponents this year.

Washington went 3-2 as well against ranked opponents this year.

I read an article yesterday that pointed out that OSU gave up over 20 sacks the last month of the season and had terrible rushing numbers from their tailbacks late in the season. The article went on to say their were lots of signs that OSU was not playing well the last month of the season but the committee kept going back to the argument that the Big 10 was one of the best conferences. Having found out this knowledge one can make a case that OSU was not the same team late in the year as early in the year, so why not give Oklahoma a chance.

Also, lots of facts just in this thread support OSU not being the team.

Bottom line, the Big 10 flat out was not that good this year.

 

[KeatonsCorner]

"so why not give Oklahoma a chance."

Because they didn't earn it on the field..........

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

Still not sure who you were saying went 5 - 5 in the bowls though.

As it stands before the championship game, here is the list based on winning percentage:

ACC 8 - 3 @ .727
B12 4 - 2 @ .667
SEC 6 -6 @ .500,
PAC 3 - 3 @ .50
B1G 3 - 7 @ .300I'

If Clemson wins, then the ACC will finish with the highest winning percentage and SEC drops to 4th.

If Clemson loses, then the ACC & B12 ties for the highest winning percentage and SEC moves up to 3rd. (of the Power 5 conferences)

INeither am I. But the Big 10 definitely was over rated, based on its bowl showing. Worst of any Power 5 conference. Big 12, by contrast, was far better than its reputation during the season.

 

[5150]

"so why not give Oklahoma a chance."

Because they didn't earn it on the field..........

and that is the disconnect in this debate, the committee gave OSU credit for head-to-head when they beat Oklahoma but didn't give Penn State the credit for head-to-head or the 13th data point. Then add in the fact that OSU was going flat late in the year thus opening up the topic of someone else.

I have a college friend that lives in NY and works in the media business, he summed it very well. If the committee is going to take the risk and not take the conference champion then you better be right in your decision because if not it will open yourself up to lots questions.

Again, by OSU getting beat so bad and the Big 10 record I think hindsight kinda proves they should not have been the pick.

 

[KeatonsCorner]

It was not a "head-to-head" evaluation with tOSU vs. OK............. it was a "win over top 10 opponent" evaluation....


you're trying too hard.... Take the names away and evaluate:

Team 1: <---tOSU

11-1
3-1 vs. end of season Top 25 ranked teams
Schedule strength = 1st

Team 2: <---Penn St

11-2
3-2 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength = 12th

Team 3: <---- 2014 TCU

12-1
2-1 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength = 9th

Team 4: <---- OK

10-2
2-1 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
1 loss vs NON Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength - 11th


Team 1 is a clear choice

 

[5150]

It was not a "head-to-head" evaluation with tOSU vs. OK............. it was a "win over top 10 opponent" evaluation....


you're trying too hard.... Take the names away and evaluate:

Team 1:

11-1
3-1 vs. end of season Top 25 ranked teams
Schedule strength = 1st

Team 2:

11-2
3-2 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength = 12th

Team 3:

12-1
2-1 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength = 9th

Team 4:

10-2
2-1 vs end of season Top 25 ranked teams
1 loss vs NON Top 25 ranked teams
schedule strength - 11th


Team 1 is a clear choice

Actually, your the one trying to hard. The facts are on the field, Ohio State was not a good team the last month of the season and they got there butts whipped bad on national TV in semi finals Those are the facts.

 

[KeatonsCorner]

Actually, your the one trying to hard. The facts are on the field, Ohio State was not a good team the last month of the season and they got there butts whipped bad on national TV in semi finals Those are the facts.

Maybe your "lawyer buddy" can explain to you what a fact is then. TOSU's last month of the regular season, leading up to the decision for the Playoffs:

5-0
Average margin of victory = 25.2 points

 

[5150]

Maybe your "lawyer buddy" can explain to you what a fact is then. TOSU's last month of the regular season, leading up to the decision for the Playoffs:

5-0
Average margin of victory = 25.2 points

no rushing yards and gave up 20 sacks the last month of the season.

 

[topdecktiger]

no rushing yards and gave up 20 sacks the last month of the season.

If your criteria has to get so far down into the weeds as " no rushing yards and gave up 20 sack," this is a worse method than the committee.

 

[5150]

If your criteria has to get so far down into the weeds as " no rushing yards and gave up 20 sack," this is a worse method than the committee.

That was an article written by a USA today writer saying the evidence that OSU was sliding at the end of the season but the committee avoided it

 

[KeatonsCorner]

That was an article written by a USA today writer saying the evidence that OSU was sliding at the end of the season but the committee avoided it

"avoided it"

otherwise known as decided to make the proper decision on W/L, SOS, and Margin of Victory

just give it up. The selection committee chose the 4 best teams in America at the time of choosing......... it was obvious

 

[topdecktiger]

That was an article written by a USA today writer saying the evidence that OSU was sliding at the end of the season but the committee avoided it

I understand that, but "sliding at the end of the season" is simply not a good evaluation method. It's way too subjective. Like the other guy said, when you go 5-0 down the stretch, and win by an average of 25 points (trusting his numbers), it's hard to call that "sliding."

Here's the fundamental problem. The framework of the playoff itself is flawed. The committee is just a symptom of the problem. The only way to really solve it is to copy FCS. Eliminate the bowls and have a full fledged tournament.

By the way, here is another problem. Just because Ohio St got killed, it doesn't mean the other teams were any better. Would Penn St have played better against Clemson? Not necessarily. The last two years, the Big Ten has lost 66-0 in the playoffs. Point being, the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

 

[5150]

"avoided it"

otherwise known as decided to make the proper decision on W/L, SOS, and Margin of Victory

just give it up. The selection committee chose the 4 best teams in America at the time of choosing......... it was obvious

We can agree to disagree but I think the Big 10 and OSU were highly overrated and when we were sold on the new system the goal was to get the 4 best team on the field thus doing away with the old selection process. I personally think 2 to 4 other teams could have given Clemson as good or better game then OSU. That is my opinion!

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

I understand that, but "sliding at the end of the season" is simply not a good evaluation method. It's way too subjective. Like the other guy said, when you go 5-0 down the stretch, and win by an average of 25 points (trusting his numbers), it's hard to call that "sliding."

Here's the fundamental problem. The framework of the playoff itself is flawed. The committee is just a symptom of the problem. The only way to really solve it is to copy FCS. Eliminate the bowls and have a full fledged tournament.

By the way, here is another problem. Just because Ohio St got killed, it doesn't mean the other teams were any better. Would Penn St have played better against Clemson? Not necessarily. The last two years, the Big Ten has lost 66-0 in the playoffs. Point being, the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

Absolutely! 16 team playoff would take 4 weeks but, like March Madness, would generate great interest. Alabama, Ohio State, Clemson, Florida State would still get their automatics in less than great seasons, as they do now, all 5 Power 5 champs would be in, and no one could dispute who deserved to be national champs because they did it on the field. I still think it's disgusting that the 3rd place team in the Big 10 was in the Football Final Four. Never should have happened. The ratings tanked for that game, too, so ESPN lost money. Even the Clemson-Alabama classic sagged in the ratings. TV is headed the wrong way because the committee is so flip flopping in its reasoning depending on which team it's talking about. So credibility is shot. The ratings reflect that.

 

[WVUALLEN]

This thread is meaningless.

 

[MichiganHerd]

Even the Clemson-Alabama classic sagged in the ratings.

College football, whether you like it or not, doesn't have the national following that some sports have (think NFL). Throw in the fact that you had two southern schools competing, and you end up losing more national viewership. Clemson also isn't a 'big brand', like other schools, i.e., Texas, Ohio State, Notre Dame, or even a Michigan, if they were to ever make it that far, so that hurts ratings as well. Check out past ratings when two southern schools faced one another for the national championship.

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

This thread is meaningless.

So why did you add your meaningless thought? Lots of good thoughts in this thread, by the way. Including mine.

 

[Beechurst]

Why are you so jaded? Never heard this 'listen to me ' BULLSHIT out of your ass before.. what do you want? A medal? Seriously lacking in any sort of humility. You are starting to sound like the complete goof balls I try to avoid on this board...'I told them'...oh yeah...you told them alright!

Wow.....just where the heck have you been for the last decade-plus?

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

The ESPN power rankings, after the bowls, got it right.
Penn State was a better team than Ohio State, AT THE END OF THE REGULAR SEASON, when the College Football Pretzel committee made its convoluted choices.
1. Clemson
2. Alabama
3. Southern Cal
4. Washington
5. Penn State
6. Oklahoma
7. Ohio State

I will NEVER understand how the committee could make a team that finished THIRD in its own conference one of the top 4 teams in the nation at the end of the season. Why play the games if the committee is going by the name on the uniform rather than the performances in the final regular season games? You want teams that are performing at their best at that time to have a solid Football Final Four.

The CFP committee blew it, big time.

By the way, WVU is 22nd and, after the Miami game, I can't quarrel with that. But I am thrilled with the 10-2 regular season and 2nd place finish in the Big 12 (tied with Oklahoma State).

 

[KeatonsCorner]

Reread this thread then....


All the facts are contained in this thread

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

I'm glad you agree with me, at last, that picking Ohio State was a serious blunder by the College Football Pretzel committee. Welcome to the dark side.

 

[KeatonsCorner]

Your own source of the ESPN Power Rankings stated that, at the time of selection, OHIO STATE was one of the top four teams.... #2 in fact


But flip flopping is more your style in this argument......

"This source and measurement only matters when it alligns with my bias"

 

[topdecktiger]

The ESPN power rankings, after the bowls, got it right.
Penn State was a better team than Ohio State, AT THE END OF THE REGULAR SEASON, when the College Football Pretzel committee made its convoluted choices.
1. Clemson
2. Alabama
3. Southern Cal
4. Washington
5. Penn State
6. Oklahoma
7. Ohio State

I will NEVER understand how the committee could make a team that finished THIRD in its own conference one of the top 4 teams in the nation at the end of the season. Why play the games if the committee is going by the name on the uniform rather than the performances in the final regular season games? You want teams that are performing at their best at that time to have a solid Football Final Four.

The CFP committee blew it, big time.

By the way, WVU is 22nd and, after the Miami game, I can't quarrel with that. But I am thrilled with the 10-2 regular season and 2nd place finish in the Big 12 (tied with Oklahoma State).

You are focusing too much on the committee. This has been a problem with college football before. The same thing happened with Alabama in 2011. They didn't even win their division, but they won the national championship.

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

Let's just agree that, at the end of the season, Ohio State was not 1 of the 4 best teams in America. 3rd in its own conference for the season. By the end of the regular season, Penn State, Southern Cal and Oklahoma were better than Ohio State. BAD choice by the committee. Scoreless rout just provided the exclamation point to the bullheaded bias of the committee. Bad, bad choice. I named 3 teams that were better AT THE END OF THE REGULAR SEASON. Plus, of course, Alabama, Clemson and Washington. That would make Ohio State #7 at the end of the regular season. Stupid choice.

 

[KeatonsCorner]

Meanwhile, the AP and the Coaches disagree........ You know, the real "paid sports experts"

 

[topdecktiger]

Let's just agree that, at the end of the season, Ohio State was not 1 of the 4 best teams in America. 3rd in its own conference for the season. By the end of the regular season, Penn State, Southern Cal and Oklahoma were better than Ohio State. BAD choice by the committee. Scoreless rout just provided the exclamation point to the bullheaded bias of the committee. Bad, bad choice. I named 3 teams that were better AT THE END OF THE REGULAR SEASON. Plus, of course, Alabama, Clemson and Washington. That would make Ohio State #7 at the end of the regular season. Stupid choice.

But the problem is, there simply isn't a system where those teams would have jumped Ohio St. Both the AP and Coaches poll had Ohio St #2, even higher than the committee. If we were back in the old BCS system, Alabama and Ohio St would have been in the title game, and Clemson wouldn't even have made it. Thinking the committee is the problem is not being able to see the forest for the trees.

 

[Cuyahoga Falls Eers]

But the problem is, there simply isn't a system where those teams would have jumped Ohio St. Both the AP and Coaches poll had Ohio St #2, even higher than the committee. If weey
Let's understand how this works. If the committee puts a team #2, even if it doesn't belong there, AP and Coaches go along so they don't look stupid. It's the emperor has no clothes syndrome. They don't want to put Penn State higher than Ohio State if the committee doesn't. Well, the emperor (Ohio State) had no clothes and I was one of the few who said it. As for "paid experts," I was that for decades and 3 giants of industry paid me so well for it that I could afford to travel to 55 countries and 44 states. Surely you wouldn't say I'm not as smart just because I'm older. That's classic ageism and actionable in every court in America.

 

[topdecktiger]

First point, I wasn't the one who made the "paid expert" comment.

Second point, your "emperor has no clothes point" is subjective. No way to prove it.

Third point, the AP and Coaches polls come out before the committee, so they can't just "go along with the committee," because they don't even know what the committee is going to do.

Also a forth point. The "go along with the committee" argument doesn't hold water, because the AP poll has a history of not going along with the system. Remember 2003, when the AP poll voted for USC #1, even though LSU won the BCS championship.

 

[WVex-pat in GA]

But the problem is, there simply isn't a system where those teams would have jumped Ohio St. Both the AP and Coaches poll had Ohio St #2, even higher than the committee. If we were back in the old BCS system, Alabama and Ohio St would have been in the title game, and Clemson wouldn't even have made it. Thinking the committee is the problem is not being able to see the forest for the trees.

Sure there is [there simply isn't a system] but it's being improperly used. By 2017 every conference will have a CCG (however flawed). So the rule needs to be the P5 Champions and the highest ranked G5 Champion (AP & Coaches Poll) get into the playoff. Do away with the committee.

Top two ranked Champs (again, AP & Coaches Poll) get a bye in the first round and then re-seed for the second round. Let somebody else worry about the logistics, but this emphasizes taking care of business in your conference (which tOSU should have done) and makes every game important because ever team wants that 1st round bye. Messing up OOC affects that ranking so those games are important too.

It would be the best way to do it, which means it'll never happen!