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Deutsche Bank states the Trump policies could double GDP by 2018

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http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/09/dona...le-gdp-growth-by-2018-deutsche-bank-says.html

There is no question that lower corporate and individual taxes. greatly reduced business regulations, repatriation of overseas profits and Trump's infrastructure plan are very, very stimulative. The good news is that we would get away from monetary stimulus like zero interest rates and printing money to buy government bonds (QE). These have the unpleasant aftermath of creating asset bubbles and inflation. They may help the stock market, but not main street.

We will need GDP to double to help offset the Fed's rate increases.
 
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/09/dona...le-gdp-growth-by-2018-deutsche-bank-says.html

There is no question that lower corporate and individual taxes. greatly reduced business regulations, repatriation of overseas profits and Trump's infrastructure plan are very, very stimulative. The good news is that we would get away from monetary stimulus like zero interest rates and printing money to buy government bonds (QE). These have the unpleasant aftermath of creating asset bubbles and inflation. They may help the stock market, but not main street.

We will need GDP to double to help offset the Fed's rate increases.
Double GDP GROWTH, not double GDP geez. Interest rates are already going up with up to 3 planned increases so moving that way before he ever takes office. Trump is lucky to be starting with the economy in solid shape.
 
Double GDP GROWTH, not double GDP geez. Interest rates are already going up with up to 3 planned increases so moving that way before he ever takes office. Trump is lucky to be starting with the economy in solid shape.

Very picky correction. Of course I meant GDP growth. That is usually what doubling GDP means in my world. The economy is NOT in solid shape, it is fairly weak. GDP growth is anemic. Work force participation is near all time lows. U6 unemployment is at 9.6%. The market has been artifically elevated due to Fed policies which create asset bubbles and inflation. The 3 planned interest rate hikes are Yellen's attempt at a"smooth landing." But we still may experience very bad effects of both.

Even libs have to be heartened by an outfit as respected as Deutsche Bank to come out with this forecast. Greater GDP growth means more jobs and more income for those in need. A focus on bringing back manufacturing jobs, which are typically much higher paying than service jobs should also be welcomed. We desperately need a growing middle class again. Significant infrastructure spending, offset in part by repatriated overseas profits, should provide an immediate jobs jolt.
 
Very picky correction. Of course I meant GDP growth. That is usually what doubling GDP means in my world. The economy is NOT in solid shape, it is fairly weak. GDP growth is anemic. Work force participation is near all time lows. U6 unemployment is at 9.6%. The market has been artifically elevated due to Fed policies which create asset bubbles and inflation. The 3 planned interest rate hikes are Yellen's attempt at a"smooth landing." But we still may experience very bad effects of both.

Even libs have to be heartened by an outfit as respected as Deutsche Bank to come out with this forecast. Greater GDP growth means more jobs and more income for those in need. A focus on bringing back manufacturing jobs, which are typically much higher paying than service jobs should also be welcomed. We desperately need a growing middle class again. Significant infrastructure spending, offset in part by repatriated overseas profits, should provide an immediate jobs jolt.
None of the articles about declining workforce participation mention the effect of Baby Boomers leaving the workforce, estimated to be between 10,000 and 12,000 every day. Where are these bubbles, this inflation caused by Fed policies of which you speak? And do you really think that the manufacturing jobs that disappeared over the past 25 years are coming back? Even if every factory shuttered since 1980 magically reopened, they're only going to hire a fraction of the people thanks to automation and innovation. You want to know who's going to benefit from these policies? Not the middle class, unless you define middle class as people with income above $2 million annually.

And this is Reaganomics 2.0: tax reform that slashes personal and corporate taxes, and calls for at least $1 trillion in improvements for bridges, roads and other public projects. It makes me laugh how the right is always yelling about how the government should manage the debt like a household budget, when they also believe that less revenue and greater spending are somehow compatible. Even Reagan was awakened to the reality, and was forced to accept rollback of almost all of his tax cuts before the end of his first term.
 
Very picky correction. Of course I meant GDP growth. That is usually what doubling GDP means in my world. The economy is NOT in solid shape, it is fairly weak. GDP growth is anemic. Work force participation is near all time lows. U6 unemployment is at 9.6%. The market has been artifically elevated due to Fed policies which create asset bubbles and inflation. The 3 planned interest rate hikes are Yellen's attempt at a"smooth landing." But we still may experience very bad effects of both.

Even libs have to be heartened by an outfit as respected as Deutsche Bank to come out with this forecast. Greater GDP growth means more jobs and more income for those in need. A focus on bringing back manufacturing jobs, which are typically much higher paying than service jobs should also be welcomed. We desperately need a growing middle class again. Significant infrastructure spending, offset in part by repatriated overseas profits, should provide an immediate jobs jolt.
Business projections are near meaningless but get giddy anyways. Scroll down the CNBC website any day, find an article saying one thing then scroll down to find an article saying the opposite. It will be months or years before much of this plays out but keep shaking those pom poms.
 
None of the articles about declining workforce participation mention the effect of Baby Boomers leaving the workforce, estimated to be between 10,000 and 12,000 every day. Where are these bubbles, this inflation caused by Fed policies of which you speak? And do you really think that the manufacturing jobs that disappeared over the past 25 years are coming back? Even if every factory shuttered since 1980 magically reopened, they're only going to hire a fraction of the people thanks to automation and innovation. You want to know who's going to benefit from these policies? Not the middle class, unless you define middle class as people with income above $2 million annually.

And this is Reaganomics 2.0: tax reform that slashes personal and corporate taxes, and calls for at least $1 trillion in improvements for bridges, roads and other public projects. It makes me laugh how the right is always yelling about how the government should manage the debt like a household budget, when they also believe that less revenue and greater spending are somehow compatible. Even Reagan was awakened to the reality, and was forced to accept rollback of almost all of his tax cuts before the end of his first term.

Baby boomer account for some but certainly not all of the workforce numbers. Let me type this slowly so that you can understand. U6 unemployment is at 9.6%. That means that many, many people that want to work have given up or have settled for part time work. After all 94% of the jobs created under Obama were part time.

Asset bubbles are created when rates are artificially low. This in part lead to the housing bubble of 2008. Investors get very cheap money, take huge risks because it is so cheap, raise asset prices to unrealistic levels not supported by the fundamentals and then the bubble bursts. It has happened many times in our economic history.

Tell the auto workers they won't benefit for these jobs. Tell the energy workers they are not going to benefit from these jobs. Tell the new workers at Sprint/OneWeb they are not going to benefit from these jobs. You've adopted Obama's "we can't do better philosophy." His "new normal" attitude. Thank goodness Trump has rejected it.

And you're simply wrong about Reagan. He did roll back some taxes but even with this his tax rates dropped dramatically. We had historic economic growth under Reagan averaging a whopping 3.5% even after Volkker raised interest rates to tame Carter's massive inflation which caused a recession early in Reagan's term. We more than doubled revenues to the Treasury during Reagan's term demonstrating that lower taxes and lower regulations are very stimulative. Reagan's military build-up was both stimulative and eventually brought down the Soviet Union. He compromised with Tip O'Neill to get his military spending approved in a Dem congress. As a result, Tip wanted new domestic spending on social programs which did run up the deficit.

I believe you will see the Ryan Congress force Trump to pay for the infrastructure spending which will occur over many years. For starters, the $300B in repatriated profits will make a nice down payment on paying for that spending.

From Politifact:

So it’s accurate to say Reagan increased levies during five years of his administration, but there’s a caveat: The overall tax burden on businesses and individuals went down during his presidency.

We examined data from the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center that computes the nation’s tax revenues as a percentage of its Gross Domestic Product -- the total of all goods and services produced.

When Reagan took office in 1981, federal taxes were 19.6 percent of GDP, the highest level since World War II. That figure dropped to 17.3 percent during his first term and rose to 18.2 percent at the end of his second term.

A second analysis:

So, for those who care about the truth, here are some details. One of the tax increases Reagan signed (the Highway Revenue Act of 1982) was a temporary increase in the federal gas tax from 4 to 9 cents. (This could be thought of as a sort of “user fee,” inasmuch as the revenue generally went to roads and infrastructure.) Another was a cigarette tax (Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1985.) These are real tax increases, but should not be confused with the income tax.

(Reagan also deserves special criticism from free marketers on the right for raising the capital gains tax rate — as well as the corporate rate — in the Tax Reform Act of 1986.)

Make no mistake, these were real tax increases — in some cases, “regressive” taxation — but they pale in comparison to the scale of the income tax cuts that defined the Reagan era. Again, it’s important to put things in context. When inaugurated, Reagan inherited a nation with 16 tax brackets — ranging from marginal rates of 14 percent to 70 percent. By 1989, that was down to two brackets — with marginal rates of 15 percent and 28 percent. (Those rates — and brackets — were short lived. By the time Clinton left office, the top marginal rate was back up to 39.6 percent. But you can’t blame Reagan for tax increases that came after his tenure. That’d be like President Obama blaming George W. Bush for tax cuts passed in 2011…)

Again, my argument is that some taxes are more important than others. Do massive cuts to income taxes — perhaps the most confiscatory and arbitrary form of taxation (which disencentivize the very act of working) — carry the same weight as a temporary consumption tax increase which raised just over 3 billion in revenue a year? I would argue that the two clearly aren’t the same thing — and yet that distinction is seldom made.

So how has this canard advanced to a state where it would demand correction so many years later? Both sides have contributed to advancing this misleading narrative. It’s in nobody’s interest to clarify the distinction — that not all taxes hikes and cuts are equal. Conservatives who oppose all tax hikes (or revenue raisers such as removing deductions) gain little by exposing Reagan’s nuanced approach. Liberals benefit most from the opaqueness — because they can label Reagan a serial tax increaser — while ignoring the broader impact of his work on the federal tax racket.

Facts matter. Reagan’s legacy has been co-opted and mangled by both sides. Yes, he raised taxes. Yes he cut taxes. The real story is how he raised taxes and how he cut them. And the overarching theme is that Reagan dramatically lowered tax rates and broadened the base. He was a reformer willing to make tough decisions. And at the end of the day, his legacy is that of a free market tax cutter. “If you aggregate together all the tax hikes … Reagan was a net tax cutter,” says Americans for Tax Reform’s Ryan Ellis. “I believe that makes him unique in the 20th century Cold War era. (Kennedy’s were passed by Johnson, who later raised taxes to pay for Vietnam).”

Why is it important to set the record straight on this? Because liberals continue to attempt to hoodwink conservatives into supporting deficit reduction plans along the lines of tit for tat. “We’ll cut spending if you raise taxes.” Looking to history, though, conservatives should be wary of this feint.

Reagan was offered such a deal (a 3-1 ratio of spending cuts to tax increases) in 1982, and it’s the reason he reluctantly agreed to the largest tax increase of his presidency, the “Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act of 1982.” The Democratic Congress then promptly proceeded to ignore the planned spending cuts. George H.W. Bush encountered the same trick in 1990. It cost him the presidency. The same idea was tossed out last summer — and smartly rejected by the GOP.

President Reagan deserves better than to have his legacy misrepresented. It is healthy for us to properly assess his policies. He came into office amid very difficult times, vowing to restore the American dream. Considering the full body of his work, I’d say that was a mission well accomplished.






Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/06/06/ronald-reagan-raised-taxes-11-times-the-real-story/#ixzz4VNb4HXX0
 
Very picky correction. Of course I meant GDP growth. That is usually what doubling GDP means in my world. The economy is NOT in solid shape, it is fairly weak. GDP growth is anemic. Work force participation is near all time lows. U6 unemployment is at 9.6%. The market has been artifically elevated due to Fed policies which create asset bubbles and inflation. The 3 planned interest rate hikes are Yellen's attempt at a"smooth landing." But we still may experience very bad effects of both.

Even libs have to be heartened by an outfit as respected as Deutsche Bank to come out with this forecast. Greater GDP growth means more jobs and more income for those in need. A focus on bringing back manufacturing jobs, which are typically much higher paying than service jobs should also be welcomed. We desperately need a growing middle class again. Significant infrastructure spending, offset in part by repatriated overseas profits, should provide an immediate jobs jolt.
Money money money M O N E Y! Obama should've known that the economy is the only thing a President should worry about. I bet the amount of heart disease rises as well.
 
Business projections are near meaningless but get giddy anyways. Scroll down the CNBC website any day, find an article saying one thing then scroll down to find an article saying the opposite. It will be months or years before much of this plays out but keep shaking those pom poms.

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahba...-looks-to-expand-manufacturing-in-us-n2269231

Apple to create up to 2,000 jobs in the U.S. Ford. Carrier. Sprint and OneWeb, 5,000 jobs. Alibaba pledges to create 1,000,000 U.S. jobs. I agree that forecast can certainly be wrong. But more and more economic forecasts are projecting significant growth. Nice to read these kinds of forecasts for a change and as I already posted, small business optimism increases the most since the 80's. Business optimism, like consumer optimism is critical to our economy.
 
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http://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahba...-looks-to-expand-manufacturing-in-us-n2269231

Apple to create up to 2,000 jobs in the U.S. Ford. Carrier. Sprint and OneWeb, 5,000 jobs. Alibaba pledges to create 1,000,000 U.S. jobs. I agree that forecast can certainly be wrong. But more and more economic forecasts are projecting significant growth. Nice to read these kinds of forecasts for a change and as I already posted, small business optimism increases the most since the 80's. Business optimism, like consumer optimism is critical to our economy.
Some will say anything or simply announce plans long in the making to avoid a threatening tweet from the erratic new prez. Hopefully some of this growth kicks in before he leaves office.
 
Some will say anything or simply announce plans long in the making to avoid a threatening tweet from the erratic new prez. Hopefully some of this growth kicks in before he leaves office.

I don't recall Trump threatening Sprint or Alibaba or OneWeb. And if you recall, JFK issued threats as well, especially after the Steel industry strike. Except since he was a Democrat, the media called it jawboning. Sounds less frightening than "threatening."

To me, it doesn't matter. Pro-growth economic policies are a refreshing change from the last 8 years.
 
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We will need GDP to double to help offset the Fed's rate increases

This is the key, because without expansion of the economy we cannot expect to ever generate enough revenue to either pay off our massive debt, or fund entitlements. That's what is going to kill us unless we get this economy growing.
 
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This is the key, because without expansion of the economy we cannot expect to ever generate enough revenue to either off our massive debt, or fund entitlements. That's what going to kill us unless we get this economy growing.

Very true. To be frank, I'm not sure that economic literacy is a liberal strength.
 
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http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/09/dona...le-gdp-growth-by-2018-deutsche-bank-says.html

There is no question that lower corporate and individual taxes. greatly reduced business regulations, repatriation of overseas profits and Trump's infrastructure plan are very, very stimulative. The good news is that we would get away from monetary stimulus like zero interest rates and printing money to buy government bonds (QE). These have the unpleasant aftermath of creating asset bubbles and inflation. They may help the stock market, but not main street.

We will need GDP to double to help offset the Fed's rate increases.
I would be highly disappointed if that standard is not exceeded in the 3rd Qtr. It is just a matter of removing the obstacles at EPA to release the constraints
 
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I'm not sure religious or racial literacy is a conservative strength. See I can do it too. BS

I'm being sincere. Liberals don't seem to focus on business schools as majors. If you look at most colleges, even the most liberal, their business schools tend to have the highest percentage of conservative professors. Not sure why, but it is the case.

As a consultant, I worked with many of the largest energy companies in the country and the executives were overwhelmingly conservative. My colleagues in other industries had similar experiences. I am not making a judgment of good or bad, just an observation.
 
Money money money M O N E Y! Obama should've known that the economy is the only thing a President should worry about. I bet the amount of heart disease rises as well.

Actually, elections are generally won based on pocketbook issues. Surprised you did not know this.
 
I would be highly disappointed if that standard is not exceeded in the 3rd Qtr. It is just a matter of removing the obstacles at EPA to release the constraints

I think if we see oil back up to $60/bbl., there will be an energy explosion under Trump. We already see Trump getting ready to rapidly approve pipeline construction held up by Obama. Great for the gas industry. And these energy jobs pay very, very well.
 
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I'm not sure religious or racial literacy is a conservative strength. See I can do it too. BS

I don't quite get the analogy boomer. Religion and race are used by the Left chiefly to vilify many people on the Right, yet economics literacy is not something Conservatives use to attack the Left. However when there is debate on general awareness of certain fundamental economic principles or even how our free enterprise Capitalistic economy functions, a vast majority on the Left are clueless, at least based on the arguments they make.
 
I don't quite get the analogy boomer. Religion and race are used by the Left chiefly to vilify many people on the Right, yet economics literacy is not something Conservatives use to attack the Left. However when there is debate on general awareness of certain fundamental economic principles or even how our free enterprise Capitalistic economy functions, a vast majority on the Left are clueless.

He was posting tongue in cheek, imo. But for much of the Dem base, I agree that their knowledge of the fundamentals of micro and macro economics is lacking.
 
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Double GDP GROWTH, not double GDP geez. Interest rates are already going up with up to 3 planned increases so moving that way before he ever takes office. Trump is lucky to be starting with the economy in solid shape.
Solid shape = LIE!!!!!!
 
Sorry, should have said great shape.

Moe, are you satisfied with the debt he's leaving as a legacy which is the largest of all previous U.S. Presidents before him combined?

If it's not his fault, then who do you blame?

I assume you're blaming G.W. Bush for the debt Obama inherited?
 
Moe, are you satisfied with the debt he's leaving as a legacy which is the largest of all previous U.S. Presidents before him combined?

If it's not his fault, then who do you blame?

I assume you're blaming G.W. Bush for the debt Obama inherited?
Could Obama shut down the Department of Homeland Security? Or end the war in Afghanistan? He ended the war in Iraq and we all know according to Trump - that created ISIS. A poor economy. How was he supposed to get anything done?

Will you say the same about Trump when we spend crazy amounts of money on the wall, and infrastructure and also cut taxes on businesses and the wealthy?

Clinton was the only President in my lifetime that operated on a surplus---how else can we attack the debt?
 
Could Obama shut down the Department of Homeland Security? Or end the war in Afghanistan? He ended the war in Iraq and we all know according to Trump - that created ISIS. A poor economy. How was he supposed to get anything done?

Will you say the same about Trump when we spend crazy amounts of money on the wall, and infrastructure and also cut taxes on businesses and the wealthy?

Clinton was the only President in my lifetime that operated on a surplus---how else can we attack the debt?

A few corrections. Obama ended our involvement in Iraq out of which ISIS grew. We are now back in Iraq with nearly the 10,000 troops requested initially by Leon Panetta, the CIA and even Hillary. A gigantic strategic mistake, one of many foreign policy blunders.

If Trump runs up debt even close to the level of Obama over his tenure, I will be the first to complain. We have too much debt and we need to grow GDP dramatically to begin to reduce the deficit. Obama averaged a pathetic 1.6% GDP growth, 4th lowest in U.S. recorded history. Trump needs to double that if not more to achieve the kind of growth we need.
 
Answers to your questions to me boomer


Could Obama shut down the Department of Homeland Security? Or end the war in Afghanistan?

He did none of those. DHS is an agency created by Congress and funded primarily through dedicated revenue collected from airline fees and tickets. Obama promised to end our entanglement in Afghanistan, and significantly expanded our operations there shortly after taking Office.

He ended the war in Iraq and we all know according to Trump - that created ISIS

The status of forces agreement that the Obama administration did not secure after Bush left office led to our withdrawal from Iraq but not an end to the conflict. We still have a military presence there, with a reduced but less effective troop contingent as well as significant other military assets currently being used in the fight to retake significant portions of the country from Isis which had no such control prior to Obama taking office.

A poor economy. How was he supposed to get anything done?

Real GDP was higher, unemployment, and the overall debt were all lower before Obama took office. now Real GDP is lower or nearly at zero, real unemployment as well as overal debt are at all time highs.

Will you say the same about Trump when we spend crazy amounts of money on the wall, and infrastructure and also cut taxes on businesses and the wealthy?

Yes. However those specific policy proposals of Trump are all designed to grow the economy and reduce deficit spending. Mexico will reimburse or offset our expenses for construction of the wall, tax cuts will generate increased economic activity and revenues to pay for infrastructure and reduce deficits as we cut spending and pay down debt from economic expansion.

Clinton was the only President in my lifetime that operated on a surplus---how else can we attack the debt?

Operating surpluses in discretionary spending appeared for a brief while during the last two or three years under the Clinton Presidency after the Republican Congress elected in '94 forced him to sign Welfare reform and lower budgets with more mandated deficit reductions. He and the Democrat leadership in Congress vigorously fought Welfare and all of the other proposed budget reforms, they voted against almost all of the balanced budget resolutions, and argued for increased across the board spending against Republican proposals from Congressional appropriation committees for more tax reductions and more drastic cuts in discretionary spending.
 
Answers to your questions to me boomer




He did none of those. DHS is an agency created by Congress and funded primarily through dedicated revenue collected from airline fees and tickets. Obama promised to end our entanglement in Afghanistan, and significantly expanded our operations there shortly after taking Office.



The status of forces agreement that the Obama administration did not secure after Bush left office led to our withdrawal from Iraq but not an end to the conflict. We still have a military presence there, with a reduced but less effective troop contingent as well as significant other military assets currently being used in the fight to retake significant portions of the country from Isis which had no such control prior to Obama taking office.



Real GDP was higher, unemployment, and the overall debt were all lower before Obama took office. now Real GDP is lower or nearly at zero, real unemployment as well as overal debt are at all time highs.



Yes. However those specific policy proposals of Trump are all designed to grow the economy and reduce deficit spending. Mexico will reimburse or offset our expenses for construction of the wall, tax cuts will generate increased economic activity and revenues to pay for infrastructure and reduce deficits as we cut spending and pay down debt from economic expansion.



Operating surpluses in discretionary spending appeared for a brief while during the last two or three years under the Clinton Presidency after the Republican Congress elected in '94 forced him to sign Welfare reform and lower budgets with more mandated deficit reductions. He and the Democrat leadership in Congress vigorously fought Welfare and all of the other proposed budget reforms, they voted against almost all of the balanced budget resolutions, and argued for increased across the board spending against Republican proposals from Congressional appropriation committees for more tax reductions and more drastic cuts in discretionary spending.
Got it: everything good= republicans. everything bad= democrats. Simple
 
Got it: everything good= republicans. everything bad= democrats. Simple

No Man not at all! Republicans in many of those scenarios are just as much to blame as Dems in terms of increasing our debt ceilings and refusing to make actual cuts in discretionary spending.

Moe said Obama left the economy in great shape, so I assume he is giving Obama credit for the shape it's currently in? I'm just trying to accurately point out what that is now, and what it was before he came into Office and what the budget and debt looked like when Clinton was in office.

Republicans spend money we don't have just like the Dems. None of them care about fiscal discipline, they all fight over who gets to run up debt.

I'm not excusing them since they are as guilty as Democrats for this mess.

But as I mentioned the other day, whenever the fight is on about balancing budgets, cutting taxes, reforming entitlements, or reducing overall Government... the Left and most Democrats are against all of that, while many Republicans only pay it lip service.
 
Obama averaged a pathetic 1.6% GDP growth, 4th lowest in U.S. recorded history. Trump needs to double that if not more to achieve the kind of growth we need.

If this is not significantly increased, we have no chance to pay down our debt, or fund legacy obligations in either entitlements or Federal mandates which are currently unfunded.

Unless we grow this economy at rates no lower than 3% real GDP, we face a true default on our debt, and likely collapse of our bond ratings or ability to borrow or finance any more deficit spending. We simply will no longer be able to pay just the interest on our debt...it'll be like a credit card we can't even make minimum payments on.
 
No Man not at all! Republicans in many of those scenarios are just as much to blame as Dems in terms of increasing our debt ceilings and refusing to make actual cuts in discretionary spending.

Moe said Obama left the economy in great shape, so I assume he is giving Obama credit for the shape it's currently in? I'm just trying to accurately point out what that is now, and what it was before he came into Office and what the budget and debt looked like when Clinton was in office.

Republicans spend money we don't have just like the Dems. None of them care about fiscal discipline, they all fight over who gets to run up debt.

I'm not excusing them since they are as guilty as Democrats for this mess.

But as I mentioned the other day, whenever the fight is on about balancing budgets, cutting taxes, reforming entitlements, or reducing overall Government... the Left and most Democrats are against all of that, while many Republicans only pay it lip service.
They are absolutely not against a balanced budget. They are for domestic programs aimed at growing the middle class through additional taxes on the wealthy. They are for regulating businesses, campaign contributions and tax code to prevent corporations and wealthy Americans from having too much political power. They are for providing an opportunity for liberty and financial gain to immigrants, and respecting and appreciating the immigrants who have helped drive prices down and production up through their hard work. They are for continuing practices that allow for imbalances with regard to sex and race to be corrected. They are for providing health, safety, education, and representation for every American. Do they f up in going for these achievements? Of course, but letting the market do everything is not an option Dems agree with at all.
 
Do they f up in going for these achievements? Of course, but letting the market do everything is not an option Dems agree with at all.

Which do you think the ultimate better solution boomer. Markets (us) or the Government?

What is the danger from free markets?

What is the benefit of Government control?

I just want to hear your opinions.
 
Can you give me an economic example where this has been done successfully?
  • Personal disposable income has grown nearly 6 times more under Democratic presidents
  • Gross Domestic Product (GDP) has grown 7 times more under Democratic presidents
  • Corporate profits have grown over 16% more per year under Democratic presidents (they actually declined under Republicans by an average of 4.53%/year)
  • Average annual compound return on the stock market has been 18 times greater under Democratic presidents (If you invested $100k for 40 years of Republican administrations you had $126k at the end, if you invested $100k for 40 years of Democrat administrations you had $3.9M at the end)
  • Republican presidents added 2.5 times more to the national debt than Democratic presidents
  • The two times the economy steered into the ditch (Great Depression and Great Recession) were during Republican, laissez faire administrations
https://www.google.com/amp/www.forb...omy-history-says-vote-democrat/?client=safari
 
Which do you think the ultimate better solution boomer. Markets (us) or the Government?

What is the danger from free markets?

What is the benefit of Government control?

I just want to hear your opinions.
It's not one or the other....and not under republicans either.....manipulating trade isn't free market, neither are farm subsidies or corporate tax breaks. And it's not government control of business, it's redirecting funds to grow opportunities for those that lack
 
  • Personal disposable income has grown nearly 6 times more under Democratic presidents
  • Gross Domestic Product (GDP) has grown 7 times more under Democratic presidents
  • Corporate profits have grown over 16% more per year under Democratic presidents (they actually declined under Republicans by an average of 4.53%/year)
  • Average annual compound return on the stock market has been 18 times greater under Democratic presidents (If you invested $100k for 40 years of Republican administrations you had $126k at the end, if you invested $100k for 40 years of Democrat administrations you had $3.9M at the end)
  • Republican presidents added 2.5 times more to the national debt than Democratic presidents
  • The two times the economy steered into the ditch (Great Depression and Great Recession) were during Republican, laissez faire administrations
https://www.google.com/amp/www.forb...omy-history-says-vote-democrat/?client=safari


So if I'm understanding you correctly boomer (not flame throwing here)
we need to tax corporations more in order to increase GDP.

Tax higher wage earners more in order to increase disposable incomes.

Expand Government spending and control over free markets in order to increase real GDP and investments.

Increase regulation of the stock markets and limit the amounts Corporations or investors earn in order to grow or increase their overall earnings or investments (you mentioned previously about keeping Corporations from accumulating too much power through what they earn)

Increase our national debt in order to reduce it (you said Democrat Presidents in general added less debt than Republican Presidents yet they favor debt increases more than Republicans, so I assume you think Democrats want to see greater debts in order to reduce them?

Democrat policies do not lead to recessions or Depressions, only economic expansions and balanced budgets?

Republican Presidents or policies have never caused economic expansions or reduced deficits and Democrat policies always have resulted in both?

Am I mischaracterizing or misstating what you are arguing here?
 
It's not one or the other....and not under republicans either.....manipulating trade isn't free market, neither are farm subsidies or corporate tax breaks. And it's not government control of business, it's redirecting funds to grow opportunities for those that lack

I do agree with the first half of this, but I believe the market "redirects" where the growth opportunities are because those are decisions made by individuals and not by the Government. But I agree with you on the rest.
 
So if I'm understanding you correctly boomer (not flame throwing here)
we need to tax corporations more in order to increase GDP.

Tax higher wage earners more in order to increase disposable incomes.

Expand Government spending and control over free markets in order to increase real GDP and investments.

Increase regulation of the stock markets and limit the amounts Corporations or investors earn in order to grow or increase their overall earnings or investments (you mentioned previously about keeping Corporations from accumulating too much power through what they earn)

Increase our national debt in order to reduce it (you said Democrat Presidents in general added less debt than Republican Presidents yet they favor debt increases more than Republicans, so I assume you think Democrats want to see greater debts in order to reduce them?

Democrat policies do not lead to recessions or Depressions, only economic expansions and balanced budgets?

Republican Presidents or policies have never caused economic expansions or reduced deficits and Democrat policies always have resulted in both?

Am I mischaracterizing or misstating what you are arguing here?
Yes, substantially. Corporations need to be taxed for environmental issues and health problems in the nation. Breast cancer for example is caused, among many other things, by exposure to many carcinogens that exist in everyday products. If something such as Seceret deodorant is found to contain these carcinogens, then the corporation(s) responsible for the production should be levied additional taxes to help fund treatment and research. This should be also used for some other environmental issues facing the nation.
I think corporate bonuses should be taxed as well. I've never received a 7 figure bonus, so I'm not sure how it's structured in tax liability for the individual.
But I think raising taxes on citizens making more than 7 figures by 1-2% isn't unreasonable. What's that old saying: takes money to make money.
I think redirection of investment is good. Government incentives for investment in green technology, infrastructure projects (such as trains/subways), and areas that boost certain industries (like airline travel to boost tourism).
Some regulations are redundant and ineffective, but I want regulations that protect our environment and prevent the issues that helped create the Great Recession.
I think GDP still grew under Obama (pathetic to conservatives, but it still grew), but with a balanced budget and operating on surplus instead of deficit, we can lower debt.
I think democratic policies have most certainly led to recession (a lot of economics in cyclical if I'm not mistaken), and republican policies have led to expansion. I do however think those expansions were followed by dramatic lows as well. I'd like less spike but also less drop in the chart
 
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Yes, substantially. Corporations need to be taxed for environmental issues and health problems in the nation. Breast cancer for example is caused, among many other things, by exposure to many carcinogens that exist in everyday products. If something such as Seceret deodorant is found to contain these carcinogens, then the corporation(s) responsible for the production should be levied additional taxes to help fund treatment and research. This should be also used for some other environmental issues facing the nation.
I think corporate bonuses should be taxed as well. I've never received a 7 figure bonus, so I'm not sure how it's structured in tax liability for the individual.
But I think raising taxes on citizens making more than 7 figures by 1-2% isn't unreasonable. What's that old saying: takes money to make money.
I think redirection of investment is good. Government incentives for investment in green technology, infrastructure projects (such as trains/subways), and areas that boost certain industries (like airline travel to boost tourism).
Some regulations are redundant and ineffective, but I want regulations that protect our environment and prevent the issues that helped create the Great Recession.
I think GDP still grew under Obama (pathetic to conservatives, but it still grew), but with a balanced budget and operating on surplus instead of deficit, we can lower debt.
I think democratic policies have most certainly led to recession (a lot of economics in cyclical if I'm not mistaken), and republican policies have led to expansion. I do however think those expansions were followed by dramatic lows as well. I'd like less spike but also less drop in the chart

We already have a significant jobs problem in the United States, a significant GDP growth problem and you want to raise corporate taxes significantly. You do know that we already have the highest corporate tax rate in the world, right? Liberals believe that corporations and rich people are evil. Who do you think creates jobs in this country? And I have yet to see a poor person create a job. When you tax things, you get less of them.

Obama raised taxes, raised spending, increased regulations that you your self advocate and we have an anemic economy. Reagan did the opposite and we had a booming economy. Trump plans to use the Reagan approach. We will see in 4 to 8 years which one approach is more prosperous for America.
 
Boom I'm on my mobile phone right now because my internet connection is undergoing some maintenance.

But before I get back to the computer, let's drill down on your assumptions.

On taxes, you said Democrats favor higher taxes on wealthier earners so they can expand middle class incomes and this is what happens when they do so?

Have you ever heard of something called the Laffer curve?

If so, can you explain how his economic measurements of taxation support your argument on what happens to revenues as taxes increase?

If you've never heard of it, when I get back to my PC I'll attempt to explain it.
 
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