Right. The only problem is I can't tell if you're doing it on purpose or not, so it's not as funny.
The only thing that was funny is when root schooled you on you're grammar attacks.
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Right. The only problem is I can't tell if you're doing it on purpose or not, so it's not as funny.
The only thing that was funny is when root schooled you on you're grammar attacks.
LOL, yeah....sooo epic. But you're the gift that keeps on giving, and I'm planning a good April Fools Day post this year.
Remember last year?
You're immaturity is on display as always. Sooo? I guess your're cell phone didn't pick that one up either. Still dodging the original question about football performance as always.
The question concerning Wvu's performance and how its effecting the brand.What original question?
The question concerning Wvu's performance and how its effecting the brand.
Actually, I did touch on that and you must have ignored it.
WVU's brand is stronger than ever. Increased enrollment, improving facilities, and improving recruiting are all symptoms of a strong brand, imo. We are going in a stronger direction now more than ever and our national exposure is much higher in the B12 compared to the Big East. IMO, I don't see the problem.
We aren't UCF, or Memphis. Those schools need to win big, and win now because they don't really have a brand to fall back on. WVU does. We've been playing football for over 100 years, been members of two power conferences, have had great rivalries, players and teams. I don't know exactly where we fall in the college football storybook, but our place in it is a good one.
Anyone in the business of college football knows WVU has a strong commitment to winning and competing. Every program has up years and down years, but WVU's commitment has always remained, and anyone with an opinion that is important in this saga already knows that.
Brands are built in a couple years. Our brand is the result of DECADES of work. A couple 7-6 seasons doesn't mean much, so what exactly is it you're worried about?
Baylor has been winning big recently. Would you care to have their brand right now?
5150 started this thread as another attack on DH. Remember, 5150 is part of the BS flock of followers I mentioned earlier. It's just his way of trolling and trying to make Dana and WVU look poorly.
Allot of schools are seeing increased enrollment and facility upgrades. Just because we are now members of an overrated under performing conference doesn't necessarily mean our brand has improved. Going 7-5 and being irrelevant isn't going to improve the overall image of the football program considering the Long term stability of the conference is in question. Why are so scared to make a coaching change? There are 3 possibilities the new coach could be better he could be the same or he could be worse but if all where doing is going 7-5 with invitations to crappy bowl games then it doesn't hurt to give someone else a chance. Its true that Lyons has never made a coaching hire but he has held high positions at the university of Alabama and in the ACC front office so Im sure he has allot of contacts. None of this ensures he will make the proper hire but he has more experience at the collegiate level than Luck had when he 1st came to Wvu. The majority of people don't care who the coach is as long as there is a general feeling that the program is performing at its optimal level. You're right there are some people who never accepted DH because of the Stewart issue but on the Flip side there are DH supporters who can't admit that he has failed to bring the program back into the national discussion in the way RR did.
Allot of schools are seeing increased enrollment and facility upgrades. Just because we are now members of an overrated under performing conference doesn't necessarily mean our brand has improved. Going 7-5 and being irrelevant isn't going to improve the overall image of the football program considering the Long term stability of the conference is in question. Why are so scared to make a coaching change? There are 3 possibilities the new coach could be better he could be the same or he could be worse but if all where doing is going 7-5 with invitations to crappy bowl games then it doesn't hurt to give someone else a chance. Its true that Lyons has never made a coaching hire but he has held high positions at the university of Alabama and in the ACC front office so Im sure he has allot of contacts. None of this ensures he will make the proper hire but he has more experience at the collegiate level than Luck had when he 1st came to Wvu. The majority of people don't care who the coach is as long as there is a general feeling that the program is performing at its optimal level. You're right there are some people who never accepted DH because of the Stewart issue but on the Flip side there are DH supporters who can't admit that he has failed to bring the program back into the national discussion in the way RR did.
I just judge Dana purely as a coach, nothing else.
Like I said, I don't think Dana is that bad of a coach. Going from a team expected to beat Big East programs each week to a team expected to beat B12 programs each week is very difficult. We don't have any competitive advantage against most teams in the B12.
I don't think 8 wins is that bad considering the circumstances. Two seasons ago we went 7-6. We opened against Alabama that season. Normally, that opener would have been a cupcake/pushover. I liked having the Alabama game on the schedule despite the loss, but with a normal schedule that would have been an 8 win season too, and if Trickett doesn't get hurt I think we win 9-10.
So basically, I thought the team has been going in the right direction for the last two years.
Dana just brought in a NFL talent-level QB. I'd like to see what our team looks like with a QB that good under Dana. We saw how good Geno looked under Dana and I would like to see him get his last shot with Grier. That's just my opinion.
Regarding Luck, yes he didn't have as much NCAA experience than Lyons, but he has a heck of a lot more football experience and I'd wager he has deeper connections too. But that's all history. Sometimes it's just a matter of luck and timing.
Our brand is fine and our win/loss record over the course of a couple seasons won't mean anything if the B12 crumbles.
That's my point, our brand is already firmly established. It's not something that really changes year-to-year. So likewise, if we win 10 games this season, our brand doesn't really change much. We've done it before, we'll do it again, because that's just who we are as a program.
You know what damaged our brand? Diploma-Gate and student riots.
over time average won/lose records will change our brand, and you and I both know this to be true. Im not sureOur brand is fine and our win/loss record over the course of a couple seasons won't mean anything if the B12 crumbles.
That's my point, our brand is already firmly established. It's not something that really changes year-to-year. So likewise, if we win 10 games this season, our brand doesn't really change much. We've done it before, we'll do it again, because that's just who we are as a program.
You know what damaged our brand? Diploma-Gate and student riots.
if you think that winning 7 or 8 games a season over a period of time then your just avoiding the true with is brand does change over time and it the first thing looked at by a new conference is won/lose record of its football. Also something else that can hurt the brand is the number of players being arrested which is on a big upswing in our program. Its time to stop supporting a certain coach, AD, or person and be a fan of the program. Dana is not our programWe already are playing football at a high level. Perhaps the highest level in college football. A few years ago when we were in the Big East, I'm not sure you could say the same.
I know most fans need 10 wins every season to pacify their own raging insecurities but you don't always get whatchya want.
And how do you do that? Won - lost record? Conference record? Ability to recruit a QB...and actually keep him? In game decisions? Ability to adapt to game conditions? Ability to hire...and keep...any quality position coaches? Ah.....Red Bull consumption! Got it. lol
Here we go with the big east to big 12 comparisons the typical BS we have been hearing for years. I guess TCU didn't get the memo going from a non qualifier conference to a power 5 and being able to win a share of it in 3 years not saying much about the big 12 is it? In regards to Dana bringing in an NFL talent at QB you don't now that. You don't if the guy will ever play a down here and if he does you don't how good he will be. Dana isn't running anything remotely close to what UF is running and UF hasn't exactly been a hotbed for Great NFL QB over the last 20 years.
If the Big 12 crumbles we would be in better position if we where winning 9+ games and competing for conference championships than going 7-5. You know you're brand has taken a hit when people are debating who the best team in the state of Wv is.
over time average won/lose records will change our brand, and you and I both know this to be true. Im not sure
if you think that winning 7 or 8 games a season over a period of time then your just avoiding the true with is brand does change over time and it the first thing looked at by a new conference is won/lose record of its football. Also something else that can hurt the brand is the number of players being arrested which is on a big upswing in our program. Its time to stop supporting a certain coach, AD, or person and be a fan of the program. Dana is not our program
Here we go with the big east to big 12 comparisons the typical BS we have been hearing for years. I guess TCU didn't get the memo going from a non qualifier conference to a power 5 and being able to win a share of it in 3 years not saying much about the big 12 is it? In regards to Dana bringing in an NFL talent at QB you don't now that. You don't if the guy will ever play a down here and if he does you don't how good he will be. Dana isn't running anything remotely close to what UF is running and UF hasn't exactly been a hotbed for Great NFL QB over the last 20 years.
BS has nothing to do with this debate. If we are looking for a new conference we need to be winning at a high level. Losing to a 6-6 Kansas State team is not winning at a high level. Alleers posted we need to be fans of the program not a coach. I agree. Which are you. A fan Dana or a fan of a program that sees its brand slowly being diminish when we see the conference having problems and we may be looking again.Actually, I did touch on that and you must have ignored it.
WVU's brand is stronger than ever. Increased enrollment, improving facilities, and improving recruiting are all symptoms of a strong brand, imo. We are going in a stronger direction now more than ever and our national exposure is much higher in the B12 compared to the Big East. IMO, I don't see the problem.
We aren't UCF, or Memphis. Those schools need to win big, and win now because they don't really have a brand to fall back on. WVU does. We've been playing football for over 100 years, been members of two power conferences, have had great rivalries, players and teams. I don't know exactly where we fall in the college football storybook, but our place in it is a good one.
Anyone in the business of college football knows WVU has a strong commitment to winning and competing. Every program has up years and down years, but WVU's commitment has always remained, and anyone with an opinion that is important in this saga already knows that.
Brands are built in a couple years. Our brand is the result of DECADES of work. A couple 7-6 seasons doesn't mean much, so what exactly is it you're worried about?
Baylor has been winning big recently. Would you care to have their brand right now?
5150 started this thread as another attack on DH. Remember, 5150 is part of the BS flock of followers I mentioned earlier. It's just his way of trolling and trying to make Dana and WVU look poorly.
PSU, Baylor, Miami, and UNC wont have a problem finding a conference if that becomes an issue. WVU will have a problem so winning means more to us then most. This coming season Baskeball and Baseball will play at a high level, so why not expect the same from our football program? I tell you why? Because some are fans of the coach and not the program.We won 8 games last season and only a few years removed from a BCS Bowl. I understand the passion to win but some of this talk is purely frantic.
Recruiting is better than ever, so our brand doesn't seem to be an issue with recruits.
I agree players getting arrested looks poorly, but what program doesn't share that problem? ND just 4 - 5 players arrested this week and I dont expect their "brand" changing much.
You know who has a "brand" problem? PSU, Baylor, Miami, UNC....
BS has nothing to do with this debate. If we are looking for a new conference we need to be winning at a high level. Losing to a 6-6 Kansas State team is not winning at a high level. Alleers posted we need to be fans of the program not a coach. I agree. Which are you. A fan Dana or a fan of a program that sees its brand slowly being diminish when we see the conference having problems and we may be looking again.
PSU, Baylor, Miami, and UNC wont have a problem finding a conference if that becomes an issue. WVU will have a problem so winning means more to us then most. This coming season Baskeball and Baseball will play at a high level, so why not expect the same from our football program? I tell you why? Because some are fans of the coach and not the program.
PSU, Baylor, Miami, and UNC wont have a problem finding a conference if that becomes an issue. WVU will have a problem so winning means more to us then most. This coming season Baskeball and Baseball will play at a high level, so why not expect the same from our football program? I tell you why? Because some are fans of the coach and not the program.
Im really not sure what you are trying to debate? One post you think 7 and 8 wins is not hurting the brand then next post you say you wanted Dana fired? Then the next post your raging on Huggs for losing to a good Kentucky team.Our high level basketball team got creamed by Kentucky as if we weren't even on the court and then got bounced first round by a bunch of scrubs.
Funny, you don't seem to be on a mission to smear Huggins though.
Im really not sure what you are trying to debate? One post you think 7 and 8 wins is not hurting the brand then next post you say you wanted Dana fired? Then the next post your raging on Huggs for losing to a good Kentucky team.
What is your point?
No, I don't think 7-8 win seasons, over a few years hurts the WVU brand. That's not how brands work. IMO, folks are misusing the term.
However, I said very clearly that Lyons should have fired Dana after last season. It's obvious the relationship isn't good, and just imo, I don't think Dana really is happy either.
I think the pairing has run its course and Dana has done a job well enough that he'd find other good opportunities. Luck is gone and despite his shortcomings, we at least knew where he stood with things, and what he wanted in a program. Thus far, I really have no clue what direction Lyons wants to take.
After the extension debacle, what can really be salvaged? If the relationship is toxic, cut bait.
I've said many times, make a clean break and move on.
I wasn't raging on Huggins, he's doing a good job. My point was that if you're agenda driven, the way 5150 is, you can always find SOMETHING to use as a tool to attack a coach. 5150 has a personal dislike for DH. Started from Day 1. All of his posts are meant to undermine Dana, and nothing more. It's pure horse crap.
Think about it, 5150 is now implying that if the B12 crumbles, that it will be Dana's fault if we get left out of expansion. Do you have any idea how completely stupid that is?
When these conversations start, always consider the source.
No, I don't think 7-8 win seasons, over a few years hurts the WVU brand. That's not how brands work. IMO, folks are misusing the term.
However, I said very clearly that Lyons should have fired Dana after last season. It's obvious the relationship isn't good, and just imo, I don't think Dana really is happy either.
I think the pairing has run its course and Dana has done a job well enough that he'd find other good opportunities. Luck is gone and despite his shortcomings, we at least knew where he stood with things, and what he wanted in a program. Thus far, I really have no clue what direction Lyons wants to take.
After the extension debacle, what can really be salvaged? If the relationship is toxic, cut bait.
I've said many times, make a clean break and move on.
I wasn't raging on Huggins, he's doing a good job. My point was that if you're agenda driven, the way 5150 is, you can always find SOMETHING to use as a tool to attack a coach. 5150 has a personal dislike for DH. Started from Day 1. All of his posts are meant to undermine Dana, and nothing more. It's pure horse crap.
Think about it, 5150 is now implying that if the B12 crumbles, that it will be Dana's fault if we get left out of expansion. Do you have any idea how completely stupid that is?
When these conversations start, always consider the source.
Yes, I have had a problem with Dana do you want the list if issues:
1. Over slept on a meeting with the Gov.
2. When Defensive coaches were in the film room getting players ready for practice Dana was out running around
3. Hired Joe Deforest and said defense was taking a back seat at WVU
4. Has had the highest turn over of staff in the country
5. Hired a Head of Football ops that got fired for doing crazy stuff.
I can go on and on....thank god we had an ex football player in Ollie Luck running our athletic department because he was handling all administrative duties.
Bottom line: I agree, you are making no sense, one minute you are trashing me for trashing Dana but the next minute you want him gone.
Btw,
I just want to win! If that makes me a BS lover then sorry but its time to start winning again! That's my agenda? If Dana starts winning 9 games or more a year, I will be a huge fan.
Yes, I have had a problem with Dana do you want the list if issues:
1. Over slept on a meeting with the Gov.
2. When Defensive coaches were in the film room getting players ready for practice Dana was out running around
3. Hired Joe Deforest and said defense was taking a back seat at WVU
4. Has had the highest turn over of staff in the country
5. Hired a Head of Football ops that got fired for doing crazy stuff.
I can go on and on....thank god we had an ex football player in Ollie Luck running our athletic department because he was handling all administrative duties.
Bottom line: I agree, you are making no sense, one minute you are trashing me for trashing Dana but the next minute you want him gone.
I think Lyons will replace Dana with Gibby.
If the team gets off to a really bad start, I could see Dana let go mid-season and Gibby taking over, then keeping the position.
Or if we have a great season, I see Dana leaving....perhaps for Houston.
What would Coach Holgorsen do for HC Tom Herman at Houston? Herman already makes more than Holgs and will certainly get a raise if UH beats Oklahoma and/or makes it to the Big 12. Where is he going?
What would Coach Holgorsen do for HC Tom Herman at Houston? Herman already makes more than Holgs and will certainly get a raise if UH beats Oklahoma and/or makes it to the Big 12. Where is he going?
I think he was under the assumption that if Hermann has a good year he will move up the coaching ranks to maybe a Texas or Texas am or LSU if there is an opening. Houston pretty much increased Hermann's salary to price out any mid level power five school from pursuing him. I doubt Houston would pursue coach Holgorson. Coach is already making 3 million a year and Houston would probably have to pay around 4 million when all is said and done and there not the type of program that's gonna pay that type of money for a new coach. Florida hired Coach mac at 3.5. If Holgs is trying to use wvu as a stepping stone then he probably has his sights set on something bigger than an American Conference school. If he where to end up at Houston it would be for less money and an added sense of security.
I think he was under the assumption that if Hermann has a good year he will move up the coaching ranks to maybe a Texas or Texas am or LSU if there is an opening. Houston pretty much increased Hermann's salary to price out any mid level power five school from pursuing him. I doubt Houston would pursue coach Holgorson. Coach is already making 3 million a year and Houston would probably have to pay around 4 million when all is said and done and there not the type of program that's gonna pay that type of money for a new coach. Florida hired Coach mac at 3.5. If Holgs is trying to use wvu as a stepping stone then he probably has his sights set on something bigger than an American Conference school. If he where to end up at Houston it would be for less money and an added sense of security.
That was my point. I'm not sure Dana is really happy at WVU and if an opportunity came by, such as Houston, I wouldn't be surprised if he made the move.
If Houston has a good season, Herman's stock is going to be very high. It's just a theory, that's all.
I see the possibilities, but last season will be hard to top for Herman. Final AP Top 10 with four wins over ranked teams including a smackdown of FSU in the Peach Bowl. They open with Oklahoma at home. What an opportunity!
If they remain G5 would that not be a step backwards for Coach Holgorsen?