the Big 12-2=10 and more importantly, WVU, in the long run if the whole thing (after all the hype etc) collapses? Opinions.
With Okla moving away from expansion, what happens to...
- Thread starter Rootmaster
- Start date
Nothing has changed. Texas and Oklahoma get to do what they want, whatever that is. Whether they leave or stay put, those two schools will be fine. The rest of the teams will not be fine if they leave, only if they stay. Expansion was never going to guarantee that they would stay. The best hope is that someone else in the conference can win a NC in the next 6-8 years.
No expansion = no extension of GOR = B12 is a dead man walking
We have a decade to get our feeder school (Beckley, Potomac State, etc) project up and running. Lower our acceptance rate at the main campus and hopefully will drop our drop out rate and get our ranking somewhere in the top 80 schools by 2025. Winning a few conference championships and getting into a playoff once or twice would be a huge help too.
We have a decade to get our feeder school (Beckley, Potomac State, etc) project up and running. Lower our acceptance rate at the main campus and hopefully will drop our drop out rate and get our ranking somewhere in the top 80 schools by 2025. Winning a few conference championships and getting into a playoff once or twice would be a huge help too.
No extension of GOR means OKIE leaves after 2025. At some point B12 will expand (probably by 4 teams) which will help offset the loss of Okie (and probably Ok St). Not sure if that will be enough so we need to step up and win this damn thing!
The GOR is about as good as the paper it is written on if there is no expansion. Get ready for multiple lawsuits to leave the B12 with all rights if the expansion plans fall through.
And it may be UTx, OU AND WVU at the forefront. Certainly WVU has the best case as no eastern partner is developed as promised.
The conference went into Chicken Little mode two years ago buying into the national media hype they were doomed. Now that they've figured out they're not, that big pie being split only ten ways looks damned good.
The big 12 eventually becomes the new american/Conference Usa even though the on field performance will probably reach there 1st.
The sky is falling.
And if we act like we know all about it we'll convince ourselves that we're on top of things.
And if we act like we know all about it we'll convince ourselves that we're on top of things.
OUs president countered the rumors and states he has no idea where the speculation OU is against expansion is coming from but OU has not taken a position on expansion.
A ten team CCG is still a dangerous game for the conference that will leave them out many seasons.
There's going to be money disparities if they don't do anything. Even with the ACC which is getting a network.
Nine years is a very long time to sit back and do nothing but fall behind Other conferences and receive negative recruiting. That will hurt Ou and Ut as much as anyone-- and the ACCs GOR extension proves those are rock solid legal agreements although some still can't figure that out
As of today, the BIG 12 Still has expansion meetings scheduled for Oct 17.
A ten team CCG is still a dangerous game for the conference that will leave them out many seasons.
There's going to be money disparities if they don't do anything. Even with the ACC which is getting a network.
Nine years is a very long time to sit back and do nothing but fall behind Other conferences and receive negative recruiting. That will hurt Ou and Ut as much as anyone-- and the ACCs GOR extension proves those are rock solid legal agreements although some still can't figure that out
As of today, the BIG 12 Still has expansion meetings scheduled for Oct 17.
Probably nothing but it might give that team its ticket off the Titanic.
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My feeling is that Oklahoma wants to leave and Texas doesn't. I'd rather have someone currently in the league have some stature if Oklahoma takes its marbles and goes to the SEC. All the better if that team could be WVU but I'm not holding my breath.
In my opinion what were seeing is what would have happened if the Big East "took football seriously" and allowed the Joe Pa conference to form. Cant have a league where everyone is not on equal footing. Eventually this league will fold, hopefully we dont get relegated back to a league that is not respected nationally.
Is that the same Oklahoma sitting at 1-2 that's trying to throw it's weight around?
If one day the BIG 12 doesn't exist, then WVUs hope to remain in the major college ranks will rest primarily on what they've done between now and then academically, and secondly on what success they've had athletically.
Also, all the "fans"--if they really care about WVU, better start supporting the programs because fan support is going to be critical as well.
Also, all the "fans"--if they really care about WVU, better start supporting the programs because fan support is going to be critical as well.
So much B12 doom & gloom. Back in the summer it was being heralded due to the money distribution being behind only the B10 this year.
Maybe the B12 acted properly- they looked at the candidates and talked with the tv partners and have decided that there is no gain to add any of these teams. That is what I have thought all along.
B12 has added a champ game which will put them on par with other leagues and the 13th data point.
The total revenue is better than Pac 12 & ACC (don't buy the crap on the new ACC tv deal--they have no idea what it will make if it ever even gets started).
Who know what happens when tv deal expires. I suspect ESPN will have lost so many subcribers by then that all leagues will be scratching their heads in 10 years.
Maybe the B12 acted properly- they looked at the candidates and talked with the tv partners and have decided that there is no gain to add any of these teams. That is what I have thought all along.
B12 has added a champ game which will put them on par with other leagues and the 13th data point.
The total revenue is better than Pac 12 & ACC (don't buy the crap on the new ACC tv deal--they have no idea what it will make if it ever even gets started).
Who know what happens when tv deal expires. I suspect ESPN will have lost so many subcribers by then that all leagues will be scratching their heads in 10 years.
The Big XII is not acting appropriately. They havent acted appropriately in its entire existence dating back to the SWC which is why it has always been a complete cluster of teams going in and out. When Nebraska, Mizzou, TAMU, and Colorado bolted, 3 of which were long time members and staples of the league, the Big XII should have immediately went to 12 to begin the healing process, picked up Louisville along with WVU before the ACC could get in UL's ear, take TCU and throw BYU, Cincy, UConn, and Boise State into a hat and pick out the lucky winner. What we have now has never allowed to league to properly heal from that PR nightmare, being the only P5 league without 12+ teams gives the perception of an unstable league, and the longer it takes to add two more teams, the longer it takes for those two programs that we all know will eventually be added, to stop being perceived as midmajors.
WVU will be fine. The universities in trouble, IMO, are Iowa State, K-State, Baylor, TCU and Texas Tech.
If it evolves to 4 Super Conferences with 16 teams each, will the other conferences kick any to the curb? Vandy? Wake Forest? Rutgers? Pitt? Or will they simply pick and choose the best from the Big 8+4-4+2?
I am worried about the future of my alma mater.
If it evolves to 4 Super Conferences with 16 teams each, will the other conferences kick any to the curb? Vandy? Wake Forest? Rutgers? Pitt? Or will they simply pick and choose the best from the Big 8+4-4+2?
I am worried about the future of my alma mater.
Watch out, Wake is undefeated including wins over AAC, B1G schools and the giant killers - DUKE!
If Texas, OU, and OK State (lets face it, OK politics will not allow OU to leave without OK State) leave, the remaining schools are still strong enough to band together and form a league on par with the old Big East while picking up the top AAC programs. It will be an ugly confederation of refugees, but a league with TCU, Houston, WVU, TT, K State, KU, ISU, Baylor, Cincy, UConn would still be considered "major" even if there is no title contender, much like the old Big East. The perception will be negative from outsiders, it will probably be perceived as a "basketball" league, and there will be a constant threat of a program being poached, but the show will still go on for these schools. Lets not act like without Texas and OU, the remaining schools are on par with ECU, UCF, Marshall, USF, etc.
I'm not sure if anyone gets kicked out but I Think you're correct that WVU is positioned better than Iowa State and K-State at least.
WVU's option would be the SEC or ACC if they lost members to the SEC/B1G.
IMO, I do think the B1G has eyes for some ACC teams, as does the SEC.
I think WVU's best shot is a raided ACC. But even then you have UCONN and others.
SEC has their pick of anyone east of the Mississippi at this point, they are not ever going to pick WVU.
ACC is our best shot, I just dont see the ACC ever taking us. They have had so many chances, and I also think they're having buyers remorse from expanding beyond 12. If anything that was a "strategic buy" to eliminate the pesky Big East football conference.
Well it really depends on the strength or the perceived of GORs. The ACC has one, so will, for example Virginia Tech and NC State be able to make the move if the SEC called? Likewise UVA and UNC for BIG?
If the B12 collapsed and no ACC teams were available, yes, I think WVU is a candidate for the SEC.
Would Texas AM allow Texas in? What options would be digestible and possible?
I could see Oklahoma to B1G, all kinds of scenarios.
Sometimes it's just about being the best AVAILABLE piece on the board.
I think a lot of decision making power has shifted to the football schools in the ACC. Which would help WVU.
I think a lot of decision making power has shifted to the football schools in the ACC. Which would help WVU.
The SEC wants to monopolize college football. Sure West coast football will still exist, northern football will still exist, some decent programs in the midwest and mid atlantic will still exist, but for the most part, they want to blow every other league away monetarily, and lock up the perception that whoever wins the SEC is the king of CFB and the rest of the games are just formalities. All due respect to VT and NCSU, but they do not further that mission, WVU does not further that mission. SEC's next move is for Texas, Oklahoma, Florida State or Clemson if not all 4. Texas A&M does not have a say if Texas and the SEC come to terms. Either way, if WVU ends up anywhere other than the current Big XII, or a Big XII/AAC refugee league, it is only as a replacement for the ACC following a departure of some big time programs.
You didn't address my point. If those teams aren't available (Clemson, FSU), then what?
As I said, it depends on the perceived strength of the GORs.
If their mission was what you stated, then why the hell did the select Missouri?
You are wrong about Texas AM not having a say to keep out Texas. Of course they have a say, they are voting members and political animals like everyone else. It's been rumored for a long time Florida has kept out Florida State, BC kept out UConn, and I'm sure South Carolina would be against Clemson.
There's an internal political game that needs played.
That doesn't even address their networks and what their media partners encourage. Duplication of markets seems discouraged.
So why didn't the SEC take Florida State over Missouri? FSU wasn't under GOR then, no one in the ACC was.
I think Oklahoma would prefer the B1G.
But can they release themselves from Oklahoma State?
Oklahoma and Texas are the big trophies left on the board.
Some how we need the ACC to get raided, because the more movement the better for us.
But can they release themselves from Oklahoma State?
Oklahoma and Texas are the big trophies left on the board.
Some how we need the ACC to get raided, because the more movement the better for us.
I'm not buying the doom and gloom. But if it implodes it implodes. But it hasn't and until it happens, IF it happens, there is really nothing say about it.
But what exactly happens if WVU's athletics got knocked down a couple of notches? What, of any real importance, changes if WVU athletics gets knocked down?
I'm not saying I want to see it happen. But if it did .... so what?
Meanwhile ..... let's keep talking about it because we can convince ourselves that really know what we are talking about. The OP asked for opinions. It's my opinion that speculating on this scenario is nothing more than Chicken Little talk.
You continue to talk about the ACC--do you honestly NOT realize that conference is now secure through 2036? Why do you think ESPN had them extend the grant of rights, secure NDs membership with that conference if they join one, and offer them a network in 2019?
They aren't poachable for two decades which is more than a decade more than the BIG 12s contracts last at this point.
Right now unfortunately the BIG 12s future is the one on the line. Multiple BIG 12 schools will be in trouble if things go poorly.
WVU as an institution will be irreparably harmed if they lose major athletic status.
That brings in students and donations and provides millions in advertising the school would have to spend itself. Not to mention the financial blast that would be after state taxpayers and the AD have spent billions on facility improvements etc.
The fanbase is very fickle now--imagine it when the only P5 on the schedule is an away game.
FSU and Clemson are locked up until 2036--they'll go after OU and UT and then? Maybe TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma State.
I heard this on Mike and Mike this morning. Here is how I think it will shake out
4 sixteen team super conferences if the Big XII folds. That leaves 9 slots for 10 teams and someone is $hit out of luck.
SEC - Texas and Texas Tech
PAC 12 - Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Baylor, and TCU
BIG - Kansas and Kansas State
ACC - WVU (Iowa State IF the ACC tells the Golden Domers to either $hit or get off the pot with football.) None of this would have been necessary IF the Providence Pu$$ies had told the Golden Domers the same thing years ago.
And none of that would be necessary had Eddie Pasthisprime been anywhere near as proactive as Ollie Luck instead of waving bye bye while BC, VPLies, and Cryami jumped to the Asheshe.
In todays world of college football, the true money is in a power conference. The Big XII is already odd man out since we do not have a title game. Marshall used to have a saying that goes "winning is everything and nothing else matters." Same holds true for the conference talk. "Being in a big conference is everything and nothing else matters." Being in a major conference is the only thing left holding up WVU. Without being in the exclusive club, what we know now would collapse and we would be worse off than we were 30 years ago when we were an eastern independent. We just do not have the fan base or finances to support what we now know as WVU athletics. We would NOT want to be where Marshall is now.
My argument is that if Texas, OU, and OK State left we would still be in a power conference. I dont agree that WVU athletics would collapse onto itself if we ended up in the AAC, thats very dramatic. Theres plenty of solid programs outside of the P5, many of which are significantly better than the lower rung of teams in the P5. Sure the school will monetarily take a hit, but its not the end of the world. Were not winning national championships whether were in or out of a P5, nothing will change other than the schedule.
Right now WVU gets roughly $30 million from the Big XII. If the Big XII folds, that all goes away. No other conference below the power conferences can pony up that kind of money. That kind of money would be impossible to replace with the state in its current financial mess. Now the conference may survive if Texas and Oklahoma both bolt, but no one comes to mind as caliber schools to replace those two. Our only hope is to land in the SEC as Saben may have enough pull for that to happen. We already know that the Blue Bloods on Tobacco Road have no use for us. If they did, we would have been part of the ACC when the old Southern Conference fell apart.
