Trump Committed Fraud By Inflating His Assets, Judge Rules
- Thread starter Soaring Eagle 74
- Start date
What's your opinion of Bideninflation on your assets?
@Soaring Eagle 74 ...obviously speechless because he doesn't have any assets!
...or is it Bideninflation has wiped out what little you had?
Guilty of sexual assault. Guilty of fraud. And trials to address 91 charges are on the way. Most successful conman in history is getting legally eviscerated before our eyes.
So you'd think his popularity would be in the toilet by now with so much criminal behavior and lawlessness and all right? Nope... instead his popularity is at an all time high.
Doesn't that just frustrate the Hell out of you?
CBS poll shows Trump's big lead grows as GOP voters dismiss indictments
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Well, there's no debate about this: Right now, the Republican Party would easily re-nominate Donald Trump for 2024. And it's not close. The former president now holds his largest lead over his rivals in our polling amid his recent legal troubles. In fact, most of his voters cite those troubles as yet one more reason to show him support.
See bamaEER, that last line is what you just can't figure out! You think in your media mind numbed cranium that all of Trump's indictments and convictions and just general bad press should have buried him by now right? I mean isn't that why you and your lobotomized friends on the Left keep posting all of this drivel almost daily...ya'll think this is hurting Trump's popularity correct?
Know what your problem is? Let me break it down to 'ya OK?
Among Trump's supporters the media is hated even more than you guys hate Trump! We support him because you all love to present their smears as fact. (you're obsessed with it in fact) The more you guys rely on their lies and smears & hit pieces, the stronger his support grows. Have you even noticed that? It is indisputable.
If I were you, I'd give up hoping more media "hit pieces", indictments, convictions...whatever you think will finally destroy Trump...is ever going to work. As I said, the more you myrmidons rely on all that media hyped caca to defeat him, the more you assure his victory. Axiomatic my man!
If you truly don't want to see Trump back in the White house, stop reading media hit pieces, stop believing just one more slanted story will destroy him, stop putting all of your hope into the "fake news" eventually throwing enough darts at him will stop him! You're actually guaranteeing the very result you detest the most. Lemming.
bamaEER finally getting it when it comes to Trump and the media frenzy trying to stop him
Nah....you'll be posting some other media drivel probably tomorrow.
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Monday is court hearing about damages. The base is 200 million but the judge could determine much more based on severity of biff’s crime, maybe as much as 600 million. You Bifftards better start writing some checks.
If
If exaggeration is now fraud, couldn't Biden be charged with the same for exaggerating his IQ and education? I mean it's on video all the way back to 1988 when at the time ( better class of democrats) the msm called him snake bit for being a habitual lier.
Using simple logic here...who "undervalues" anything they're trying to sell? I recently had a 2011 Explorer that was my Wife's truck in pristine condition but had 178,000 miles on it. I didn't want to give it away so I sold it. KBB (Kelly Blue Book) on it was slightly over 3K, but I had it on the market at 4500.00. It was a nice 4 wheel drive Limited, loaded with sunroof, heated leather seats, automatic load leveling, trailer package...the works. I had a guy offer me 4800.00 for it (after several other offers meeting my asking price)
Did I tell him it was only worth only 3K? No... I sold it to him @ 4800.00.
So Trump overvalues his real estate holdings? He can price it at whatever he thinks the market will bear, unless someone pays his asking price it doesn't mean didly squat. Leftists are so desperate. Instead of coming up with a plan to control our open border and stop this illegal invasion, they're worried what Trump thinks his various property holdings in decaying New York City are worth?
I wouldn't buy real estate up there if they were giving it away!
Asking a modern day Democrat to understand any part of that would be like asking dogs to stop sniffing each others butt.
Good job on the explorer. Trump's property was/is worth what someone is willing to pay for it . If Trump felt it was worth a billion than it's worth a billion.
My property here in WV is priceless I wouldn't trade it for anything.
Never expect Leftists to understand basic economics. They think deficits are caused by tax cuts.
I think this is a bad precedent and the judge is going way above and beyond on this. But apparently you don't understand what the crime was here. Its not just saying his building is worth $1B in a negotiation to sell it, find a market rate through negotiation, and then pay taxes on his profit.
He's overvaluing his assets in order to get OUT of paying taxes, and to fraudulently obtain loans. Of course if your 10k square foot apartment is valued between $30M-$50M (or whatever) and you claim its $50M or even $70m that's one thing. To lie on a legal document saying its actually 30k sq ft and worth 10x what its really worth, that is an easily proven lie. First, the square footage is documented and easily verified. Second, you can't just come up with a number out of thin air that everyone knows is a lie and say you "over valued" it. Maybe you could if there were no damages, but if its to knowingly get out of paying taxes, then its a crime.
He should certainly have to pay whatever back taxes he owes along with penalties and interest, but they shouldn't be taking away his ability to conduct business in the state, which is in essence what they are trying to do.
He's not lying as part of a negotiation to sell his property. In that case its buyer beware. He's accused of defrauding the IRS and fraudulently obtaining loans. Those are two completely different things.
He's also accused of saying his real estate is worth much less than it actually is...when it suits him...i.e. to take a loss and get out of paying taxes. When you are using real estate values as a means of paying taxes and obtaining loans you are supposed to get the property properly evaluated and audited by a CPA to verify the actual value. He just made the shit up based on whatever value (high or low) ended up reducing his taxes.
I agree with most of this, but in the case where specific loans are being sought and property is being offered as collateral to obtain the loans, that's where you typically bring in independent property appraisals and look at tax assessments records so the lender can have a clear picture of the market to determine the actual value of the property. You don't use some Judge who just arbitrarily decides what some property is worth, because that's not based on any true market analysis.
If Trump did anything wrong here, it was probably thinking his properties were worth as much to someone else as they apparently were to him, but as I mentioned earlier ITT, he can think they're worth gold but if he only gets offered peanuts he's going to have to settle for peanuts if he wants to sell 'em!
Otherwise everything else you said here is pretty much spot on, however I personally still wouldn't invest in New York City real estate. Not only are taxes up there outrageous, stuff up there is way too overpriced or overvalued. I have relatives who live in Mt. Vernon and their home is crazy expensive compared to something similar down here in Atlanta. Matter of fact, the home values here are far better by comparison and that's the main reason they want to leave NYC and relocate down here! New York City as an investment? No Thanks.
If the properties weren't worth what he was attempting to borrow, how was he "fraudulently" obtaining the loans?
Whatever taxes he owed on them would be based on assed valuations, not what he claims the properties were worth.
Why hasn't the IRS audited him for this, and either prosecuted him for it, or demanded whatever back taxes he owed? Why did it take all this time for the IRS to discover he owed taxes on assets he wasn't claiming? Why didn't the IRS prosecute this case if it's a violation of his tax obligations? If he paid taxes on what the property was worth, where's the fraud? If the loans against the value of the property were obtained under false pretenses, why didn't the lender raise a red flag or accuse him of fraudulently obtaining the loans, or demand reimbursement for their loss?
In auto financing, if a borrower makes false statements about their assets or income, they either don't get the loan or if they get the loan and then don't pay it all back, all of their liquid assets (including income and/or the vehicle) are legally recoverable by the lender. As far as I can tell, Trump's lenders weren't trying to recover his properties or secure missed payments from him, or even cite him for fraud on undervalued properties. No one tried to seize his properties back as collateral or taxes owed to them. Not as far as I can see. You see it differently? If so how?
This is just another smear disguised as a scam Trump was alleged to be running but it's not supported by how most lenders, tax assessors or even the IRS operates!
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Lmao! Why don’t you fvcktards just give up with this nonsense. The American people see through this sham. Either beat him fair and square in the election or STFU. If the American people want Trump as POTUS, then take a seat and wait until 2028.
His property values were inflated when he was obtaining loans, and they were artificially low when calculating taxes. Those are 2 different processes. 1) When calculating his taxes, he artificially lowers the value of the property to say he's operating at a loss...to the point many years he didn't pay any taxes. 2) When obtaining a loan, he inflates the value of the property, which inflates his net worth, which allows him to qualify for loans he normally might not have been able to. All of the documents you need to sign in that process require an attestation that you are providing accurate information. Loans in the hundreds of millions would probably require audited financials, which means you can't just say "I value it as this." Its not an art. You take comps of other buildings, homes, etc and its pretty straightfoward. They are saying his evaluations were not.
Although, I agree 100% that Mar-a-Lago is worth way more than $18M. That could be $300M for all I know. So, I'm not sure how accurate the judge is with the other properties.
The judge ruled that was a fact based on the evidence. The IRS has audited him. This stuff is notoriously tough to prove...especially for high net worth individuals with multiple companies, etc. But this judge is saying the evidence is cut and dried and apparently this process isn't as convoluted as the IRS.
Trump has been lying about his real estate and in general from the beginning. He's a shameless sel-promoter. He was obsessed with his public net worth. He knew it would give him business cred. He's quoted as saying, "My net worth fluctuates, and it goes up and down with the markets and with attributes and feelings..." He does it on a whim, and he got called out for it.
I don't know about all the other cases, some of which are non-sense, but this one is pretty straightforward and obvious. Just because the others might not be doesn't mean this one isn't.
If the properties were being used as collateral (which apparently they were) no lender would make the loans without verifying their true market value. Trump can't "inflate" values on his own simply by stating it, something like that has to be verified by an independent appraisal which is standard procedure for most equity financed loans. Besides, property tax assessments are not done by the individual property owners, they're assessed by the local jurisdictions who eventually collect the taxes.
Again, the IRS would have probably questioned this, or at the very least asked him to provide the documentation of the loss. I actually don't blame him for taking whatever deductions that were legally available to claim a loss to lower his taxes. The problem comes if his deductions were illegal? I don't see where the IRS has charged him with filing false returns, or taking illegal deductions.
Again, no responsible lender protecting their investor's assets would make loans without verifying the income/asset statements of a borrower. (ie: Trump) Chances are he already had established lender(s) with revolving lines of credit he could access based on his holdings or overall net worth, so they may not have had any problems with him overvaluing some properties in his portfolio, and undervaluing others. If the lender(s) weren't complaining about fraud or default, and were getting repaid in full... where exactly was the deceit?
Unless they had some independent analysis to show Trump was claiming losses no one else in the market was claiming, or that his properties were priced way beyond what similar properties in that market were worth, I can't see what he's done wrong? If he owed taxes and didn't pay them, that's another story. However he's not charged with not paying taxes, he's charged with paying less than this Judge or Prosecutor thinks he should have based on what they think his properties were worth. That's not only unsupportable based on their charges, but it's probably legal malpractice since neither that Judge nor the Prosecutor are real estate experts. That's not their call to make. The IRS hasn't even made that call! If he doesn't legally owe any taxes on the established value of those properties, this is nothing but more Lawfare and just another giant scam to smear him and keep him from winning back the White House.
Won't work. Most folks are already past it and ignoring it. Trump doesn't have to do business in New York State, it's a lousy business climate anyway.
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People see it 82. That's exactly why Trump continues to gain support each time they pull this sideshow. Get ready for more. Hearings into the Biden family corruption are gearing up and as each new revelation emerges, the anti Trump cabal will no doubt find something else to charge him with.
None of it will work. Trump is winning, they know it, and they grow more desperate the more his popularity grows.
None of it will work. Trump is winning, they know it, and they grow more desperate the more his popularity grows.
Regardless the judge determined he did it. So, doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
And since it looks like Hunter and probably Joe were also up to no good, they should (Hunter definitely is) be investigated too.
The Judge had no expertise to determine if the taxes legally owed on those properties were too low. He's only asked to rule on the legality of the taxes, nothing was illegal if all taxes legally assessed were paid. It will and should be appealed and probably will be overturned, especially since the ruling was made without input from an impartial jury!
Agree with you on Hunter and creepy Joe.
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