Paterno warned about Sanduski in '76
- Thread starter CAJUNEER
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Sorry. I did not notice your post on the article...probably because I usually pay no attention to you.
I did notice, ...no surprise there....but I've never thought Joe believed it....just don't think his generation gets child sexual abuse....remember many of his generation still won't beleive Catholic priest sexually abused children....I also don't think we will ever know the truth of it. In Pa. thye can't pass a state budget but they found the time to sue the NCAA
I was waiting for this to drop. Not that I had specific knowledge of this allegation but there's been too much anecdotal evidence suggesting Sandusky's activities were more widely known than the 1998 and 2001 incidents.
I grew up in a PSU household and the name Paterno did mean something within it, and I really wish these accusations and speculation were false, but my pragmatic nature won't let me give into those feelings. Something very wrong took place and it seemed no one wanted to be the person who put their foot down and said, "No...no more. This ends now.".
Jerry Sandusky was an absolute monster. He victimized children who were already victims of the life they were born into. Kids who didn't have parents who actually cared about them. Kids who didn't know what proper affection or love was, or the proper expression of those feelings were. He selected the weakest of the weak in our society and as it seems, other adults knew enough to put a stop to it but never did.
Parents. Be very suspicious of any adult male that wants to ever be alone with your child, or oddly positions himself to be alone with children. Coaches, teachers, other family members...none of them should have a reason to be alone with a child who is not their own. Very few men that work with children are pedophiles but almost every serial pedophile does position himself to work with children.
I grew up in a PSU household and the name Paterno did mean something within it, and I really wish these accusations and speculation were false, but my pragmatic nature won't let me give into those feelings. Something very wrong took place and it seemed no one wanted to be the person who put their foot down and said, "No...no more. This ends now.".
Jerry Sandusky was an absolute monster. He victimized children who were already victims of the life they were born into. Kids who didn't have parents who actually cared about them. Kids who didn't know what proper affection or love was, or the proper expression of those feelings were. He selected the weakest of the weak in our society and as it seems, other adults knew enough to put a stop to it but never did.
Parents. Be very suspicious of any adult male that wants to ever be alone with your child, or oddly positions himself to be alone with children. Coaches, teachers, other family members...none of them should have a reason to be alone with a child who is not their own. Very few men that work with children are pedophiles but almost every serial pedophile does position himself to work with children.
what does it matter? Sadly the NCAA caved in and lifted their sanctions on penn state because (according to PA politicians) it was "too harsh". That university could burn to the ground for all I care.
Hopefully the depositions are unsealed and the assistants who witnessed Sandusky are identified and they have the opportunity to share their stories. I read the AD at the time is in poor health.
Obviously, it doesn't take much effort to speculate who those assistants were.
This allegation comes from sworn testimony and I assume those assistants were subsequently deposed themselves. So potentially there may be some very explosive on the record statements. There could also be some folks sweating some serious bullets if they were less than honest in their depositions who didn't know these claims were identified.
Just another twist in an unfortunate, sad, but incredible story.
Obviously, it doesn't take much effort to speculate who those assistants were.
This allegation comes from sworn testimony and I assume those assistants were subsequently deposed themselves. So potentially there may be some very explosive on the record statements. There could also be some folks sweating some serious bullets if they were less than honest in their depositions who didn't know these claims were identified.
Just another twist in an unfortunate, sad, but incredible story.
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It matters a great deal to determine the truth, and the actual scope of the incident and the liability of the people involved.
As a side note, PMA is known to be an organization that you don't want to tangle with. It's apparent they've been keeping the powder dry for their defense and I assume they're merely lighting a match with his info....but they haven't lighted the wick, yet.
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no, it SHOULD matter. My point is, it doesn't. Whenever we hear corrupt and clueless politicians saying it's time to forget and move on, "it doesn't matter, those people are gone now" it shows a lack of understanding and empathy. They should be ashamed of themselves because the truth is, it's because of money. Shutting that program down cost too much money. And that's all they care about. As for their idiotic fans, it's just as shameful they place sports above abuse.
We are talking about a child being raped by a smelly old man and their fans have the nerve to say "why didn't these kids tell anybody?" without even bothering to take into account of what kind of psychological damage it would do to a child and how a child must have felt after something so evil happening. I just went over to see what they were saying on their board and made it through a page and a half before I left. Those are truly some disgusting people and I'm sure more than half of them have kids. If you're Joe Paterno and you knew about these things happening you obviously know it's terrible enough to shut down your football program and completely ruin your school. That's a pretty big reason not to say anything. I have an 11 year old son and they wouldn't have to worry about public perception if that happened to my son, Penn State fan or not, my actions would have overshadowed anything they would have said or done. Because of the sickening way of which their fans defend these events I hope they never get this to go away.
And like clockwork the BWI Cult of Joe is out in force calling all the victims liars. They are asserting that these new allegations must be false because the child had no way of physically getting himself to Paterno's office - I don't have words to describe these people.
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they are proof the NCAA sanctions were necessary and not harsh enough. The mere fact these people still don't get it is enough reason to come down harder and issue a full death penalty to their entire athletic dept and a drastic reduction in federal and state money. The culture in Happy Endings is sickening.
A football death penalty would be fine, but it would not satisfy me. The whole truth needs to be brought to light and absolute justice bestowed on anyone who obstructed the process. Punishing a football team seems too easy. I don't know what needs to happen but once the whole truth has surfaced, I won't be short on ideas, that's for certain.
My point is that if these allegations are all true, and a group of educated, accomplished and influential adults knew that serious crimes against children were occurring and remained silent for decades, then simply suspending a football team is not what I call fitting and that outcome should not satisfy anyone who wishes to live in society ruled by laws and justice, and civility.
The entire organization deserves to be extinct. Gone. Wiped away.
Assets stripped and sold, proceeds returned to victims and members of the commonwealth. A Grand Failure on this magnitude should not continue in any form.
The entire organization deserves to be extinct. Gone. Wiped away.
Assets stripped and sold, proceeds returned to victims and members of the commonwealth. A Grand Failure on this magnitude should not continue in any form.
It has been and still is obvious several people need to be behind bars with Sandusky. I gave up on any form of NCAA punishment because the powers of politicians/money was threatened. The school can't lose accreditation to be barred from money. Sadly, I think we've seen all we are going to see in terms of punishment for Ped State.
I am pretty sure Joe believed it and knew that such crimes existed and had existed down thru the history of mankind. I believe that he was protecting the things most sacred to him. I am talking about ............. status and the love of money.
PSU provided them the jurisdiction when they signed the Consent Decree for the original sanctions, but the NCAA won't bother with these new allegations, for sure.
If a member institution has a 40 year record of criminal activity within their Athletic Office, instead of disciplining them, they should suspend or revoke their membership status.
No purpose governing an institution incapable of being properly policed. Just cut bait with the problem child.
So a member of the NCAA participates in a conspiracy to cover up decades worth of child rapes (most likely to protect the PSU football program) and you think they don't have jurisdiction to levy sanctions? Laughable...even PSU with its team of lawyers and politicians couldn't make that argument stick.
To be fair, even the NCAA didn't feel confident they had the proper authority to impose sanctions. If PSU wanted, they could have fought off the punishment (but maybe not, and that's where the danger lurks). That doesn't mean PSU didn't deserve sanctions, just that the situation fell into a grey area with no precedent to fall back on.
PSU accepted the sanctions because that was the smart move, imo. Take the deal you know you can live with rather than put it in the hands of someone else.
P.S. Happy Mother's Day Orlaco. I hope you got some breakfast in bed this morning.
In hindsight it was even better than a deal they can live with..... ...since the sanctions were reduced multiple times. Maybe that was expected. Isn't it odd that after an in depth investigation more damaging info (and witnesses/victim) is coming to the surface....but again, maybe it was out there and just not public knowledge?
I'm of the opinion that Sandusky was 'protected' by the school to save the football program from the NCAA..in the same way coaches and admins might look the other way if they found out a booster (in the past) had given players money.
I'm not sure there's another reason so many seemingly respectable people would allow those crimes for so long. ....not that I'm suggesting it's a good one.
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....and I don't eat breakfast. LowFatMilk and PorkChop did treat me to Red Lobster for an early lunch though...
I assume you're referring to Freeh's investigation and not Sandusky's criminal investigation.
From my reading these new allegations they were taken in a sealed deposition from a victim who received a settlement from Penn State. Freeh did not have access to Sandusky's victims, to my knowledge. So it's not surprising these allegations weren't uncovered by his team. As to the other coaches who supposedly witnessed Sandusky with children, I'm not sure how they fit in but I assume it's also from depositions.
These depositions would have been taken after the Freeh report was complete and Penn State was in the process of their settlements.
I'm sure Penn State has been aware of these allegations for sometime.
You may a lot of great points, but some women are predators of children as well.
Someone should make a movie about this and after paying the production costs give the profits to all of the victims.
I went to WVU and I now work at Penn State since 2013. It isn't so different than Morgantown, it many ways it is the same. A small college town surrounded by the country and blue collar people who are willing to welcome anyone and treat them like family. So the people who despise the University as much to say they wouldn't care if it burned like PunishEER are basically despising yourselves. Nobody here is in denial of what happened or trying to defend anything. These new allegations are here say and were not fully vetted, the University did pay them off just to make them go away however they were not vetted and it is not known how true these claims are. Everyone acts like it is a cult like atmosphere here and that Joe knew everything that happened. State College and the surrounding area isn't that small of a town to know everything. There are a lot of people who live, work, and go to school here. There are things that happened at WVU and other Universities that we all defended the coaches and said it's impossible for them to know everything that happens. Child predators make it their business to hide their activities and to seem like normal everyday people. As an employee of Penn State we have to take a training every year on reporting procedures and the state laws. I can say without hesitation that Joe did exactly what he was supposed to do and all he could do within the law of the State when he reported the 2001 incident. It was up to the people he reported it to to act and they did not which is appalling. Everyone here is disgusted, this isn't a culture that would in any way, shape or form support the actions of a cover up to protect the football program. With that being said, I can't help but feel that this was extremely poor timing to release something like this on the weekend when thousands of students are graduating and should be enjoying themselves and celebrating the hard work they put in with their families and moms. None of them were alive in '71 or '76, hell I wasn't even alive.
Hearsay.
These new allegations came from the testimony of a victim during his deposition. That's doesn't make them true, but to imply that they are merely rumors is not accurate. An individual went on the record, under oath and answered the questions that were asked of him and stated he told Paterno about Sandusky abusing him in 1971. Maybe he lied, but this claim isn't scuttlebutt.
I disagree that there is no denial or defense of what happened. Just take a visit to the BWI forum and you'll see their fans explicitly deny there was any wrongdoing by PSU officials and several others who think Sandusky is innocent.
You're correct that it appears Joe did what was legally obligated. That's why he was never charged with any crimes. He was simply fired and considering what happened under his leadership, I won't make him a martyr.
The university paid off the victims not to "make them go away" but because they were liable. Penn State retained settlement experts for this very reason and they took the best deal for themselves.
The individual enjoyment of PSU students, and their personal right to celebration is not something anyone outside of State College cares about. You'll get no where with that argument.
The problem you have is that the narrative has already been set, the troops have already been dispatched, and only their side of the story matters. End of story.
Anything truthful (not poisoned by rage) and from 1st hand experience (My daughter attended PSU for 4 years), is ignored as it does not fit the story line. Their vision for their reaction is of crazed revengers bearing burning pitch forks running thru the streets of Happy Valley killing all that is PSU. All....must...die.....for the sins of a few men.
Funny how these same people are not as indignant as to thousands of priests who molested tens of thousands of similiarly vunerable children for decades, if not centuries. They acknowldege it but the rage is tempered.
The priests didn't have a losing record, unlike WVU, vs PSU....there inlies much of the anger. JoePa rubbed our noses in shit for 30 plus games in a row and we never forgave him for it. That and not starting a Eastern sports league. If this happened at Rutgers or Bowling Green it wouldn't even be mentioned anymore. Foot noted and forgotten.
The real people of PSU (students, faculty, admin, alumni, maintainence, service, etc...) are just like you and me. No different than any large campus. They are ashamed of the actions of a few of their brethren just as they should be. But believe me, if this would happen at WVU (which it could) it would not taint my self worth nor my love of this University and State. We are larger than a few bad men.
So when a few PSU people say stoopid shit, remember we would have the same type people saying the same stoopid shit if faced with similiar embarrassments....just look at any message board for proof of idiocy in all of mankind.
I lost all respect for JoePa after that incident but he did want to start an Eastern Sports Conf. It was pitt and syracuse that voted it down since they were already members of the BE in hoops at the time. That is what caused him to make a case for Big10 membership back in the early 90's.
That may be so but the schools who ruined the Big East by voting against Penn State to join the conference were none other than craptastic institutions like Georgetown, St. Johns & Villanova. They needed 6 votes and got 5 instead. I imagine things wouldve looked alot different during the Big East years and maybe even now had Ped. State got in and the conference started rolling. Additions like us, Virginia Tech and Miami wouldve made the conference even more legit and possibly been the conference poaching the ACC, not the other way around. Maryland and even Virginia wouldve been legit targets and dare I say Notre Dame? Talk about not knowing what you had until its gone.. shew.
imo even a big east with psu would have still fallen apart. It was no secret ND didn't want to be in a conference with Miami. They also want no affiliation in any conference anyways. ND special priviledges by the incompetent big east front office killed the big east. It would have happened anyways.
A bunch of non-football private schools were always going to kill the Big Least. It was only a matter of time. What chafed my sides is the 30 for 30 show about it was from only basketball people when it was a football decision. That, and the fun made at WVU's expense.
I'm glad PSU wasn't added long ago. It prevented guilt by association on our part. Their program got to where it was based on lies and I think the NCAA was right in punishing them for that at least.
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anon_vmuicqnzlyp3u
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The problem with that "Eastern Conference" that paturdo wanted, Ped St football kept all their revenue while everyone else had to share. It was the same lie they use to get 7 home games. "That revenue pays for all our other sports." In theroy, it would have been a great conference but Paturdo being the selfish, egotistical rat face he was, wanted his cake and to eat to.
The Big East 30 for 30 was supposed to be from the basketball side. Outside of Miami in the 90s, there was never anything interesting from a national perspective about Big East football therefore they covered the basketball side of the story, the documentary showed what a great league it was and accurately portrayed its downfall as a direct result of football simply being the way more popular game. Outside of the stupid potshot at WVU (and to a lesser extent, the other football playing members), it was a very good documentary.
It really always was a matter of time before the football side collapsed, but the basketball schools were not the issue, and the football schools were not the issue for the basketball schools. Football-wise the conference was never going to be saved by dumping the bball schools and preemptively adding Louisville, Cincy, USF, and UConn. If anything that would have expedited its demise by further splitting up the TV pie, and it also would have caused the light to turn on in the other leagues quicker about raiding the Big East. The basketball schools would also not have been better served by going off on their own. UConn, Syracuse, and to a lesser extent WVU, Pitt, BC, and eventually Louisville and Cincy being in their league was a far better alternative to going off on their own and picking up the at the time barely known schools like Creighton, Butler, Xavier, etc. In hindsight its actually shocking it held up as long as it did.
Of course you will have a lot of Penn St fans trying to explain/rationalize a lot of the reasons why Joe Pa didn't "know" what all was going on - because that is what they "want" to believe. I made a visit to one of their boards after the latest info came and couldn't believe some of the crap that they were saying while trying to convince others.
My favorite that was written by several and agreed by many more was that it was normal for coaches to shower with young athletes, saying that was how it was when they were in school. I can't argue what they went through but I will say there was no way that older coaches ever showered with us in any sport through elementary/jr high/high school and if they had wanted to, there would have been no way I would have thought that was "normal". Maybe normal for someone like Sandusky wanting to shower with kids but that sounds ridiculous to me.
My favorite that was written by several and agreed by many more was that it was normal for coaches to shower with young athletes, saying that was how it was when they were in school. I can't argue what they went through but I will say there was no way that older coaches ever showered with us in any sport through elementary/jr high/high school and if they had wanted to, there would have been no way I would have thought that was "normal". Maybe normal for someone like Sandusky wanting to shower with kids but that sounds ridiculous to me.
They can't accept that Sandusky was intentionally putting himself in a situation were he could be naked, and alone with young boys.
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