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note cal's previous two teams had to forfeit final 4 appearances-cal's+uk's

J

john in california

All-American
May 29, 2001
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history of cheating dating back to adolph rupp (payoffs and point shaving).....joe b. hall.....eddie sutton and rick pitino could very well, imo, eventually end up making calipari three-for-three in the forfeiture department, following his sparkling habit of staying within the rules at umass and memphis......

because everyone knows all these players are flocking to the university of kentucky to take advantage of the amazing cultural, societal and educational advantages offered by such an enlightened urban environment as lexington, kentucky.....there's no way -- with calipari's and uk's squeaky clean historical image for avoiding any type of rule-bending -- that any of these players would be enticed in any financial or other way to play basketball at uk.....plus, stuff like that never, ever, happens in an upstanding conference such as the sec......
This post was edited on 3/23 5:49 PM by john in california
 
Shocking

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Originally posted by john in california:
history of cheating dating back to adolph rupp (payoffs and point shaving).....joe b. hall.....eddie sutton and rick pitino could very well, imo, eventually end up making calipari three-for-three in the forfeiture department, following his sparkling habit of staying within the rules at umass and memphis......

because everyone knows all these players are flocking to the university of kentucky to take advantage of the amazing cultural, societal and educational advantages offered by such an enlightened urban environment as lexington, kentucky.....there's no way -- with calipari's and uk's squeaky clean historical image for avoiding any type of rule-bending -- that any of these players would be enticed in any financial or other way to play basketball at uk.....plus, stuff like that never, ever, happens in an upstanding conference such as the sec......



This post was edited on 3/23 5:49 PM by john in california
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They are going to UK because it is a top tier basketball program and Cal has a history of putting kids into the NBA. I am unsure what the "urban environment" has to do with anything. Lexington is just as urban as a lot of other college towns, but I am unsure why you think everyone wants to go to college in a major urban environment.



This post was edited on 3/23 6:03 PM by Cubs79
 
Question/suspicion: Do "one and done" kids need to attend any

second semester classes?

Maybe Patino is right. Let high school kids go straight to the NBA D-League.
 
Re: Question/suspicion: Do "one and done" kids need to attend any

Originally posted by Soaring Eagle 74:
second semester classes?

Maybe Patino is right. Let high school kids go straight to the NBA D-League.
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I don't disagree with you on that, I would like to see some type of changes. But, I do always wonder why UK is the only team criticized for this. It's not like Duke, Kansas, UNC, etc etc etc don't have one and done players too. THere were 11 Freshman who declared for the NBA draft last year, only 2 of which were UK players, the same amount as Kansas.
 
show me 1 article where Cal has been found guilty of anything by NCAA PLEASE show me 1 thats all, in todays times all it takes few keys on keyboard and you will have your answer how about 0 times...NCAA cleared Rose and LATER said he was ineligible I guess Huggy bear wouldn't played him either LOL and Cal turned in Camby UMASS retired Cal's # why is that if he did them so wrong?
 
Originally posted by DavidsonEer:
Lexington is actually pretty nice, not sure if you have ever been there?
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Agreed, Lexington is a really nice town.

This post was edited on 3/23 7:50 PM by Cubs79
 
Originally posted by Cubs79:
They are going to UK because it is a top tier basketball program and Cal has a history of putting kids into the NBA.

This post was edited on 3/23 6:03 PM by Cubs79
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I think you got your cause and effect a little mixed up there. Cal gets FUTURE NBA PLAYERS to come to UK by playing footsie with the AAU scum. Tell me you've never heard of World Wide Wes.
 
Originally posted by SacreBleu:

Originally posted by Cubs79:
They are going to UK because it is a top tier basketball program and Cal has a history of putting kids into the NBA.

This post was edited on 3/23 6:03 PM by Cubs79
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I think you got your cause and effect a little mixed up there. Cal gets FUTURE NBA PLAYERS to come to UK by playing footsie with the AAU scum. Tell me you've never heard of World Wide Wes.
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I have heard of World Wide Wes. Are you aware he is also friends with Coach K, among others? Are you aware he has had a long relationship with Chris Paul, who never played for Calipari. That one of his best friends was an assistant at Oregon for a few years, yet, didn't see a whole lot of top tier talent heading there. Weird how everyone only associates him with Calipari, and not the other numerous coaches or players who never played for Cal. And, this idea that Wes is the only guy pushing kids to go to a certain school is naive. Those guys are all over the NCAA landscape, and as long they aren't paying players or things of that nature, it is perfectly legal. The fact of the matter, is that UK has what are probably the best facilities in the nation, is located in a great college town, has tradition that rivals any school in the nation, currently has a coach who wins at the college level, has probably the largest basketball fan base in the country, and plays a system that highlights guys skill for the next level. Is it really hard to believe why kids want to go there? Where do you think kids want to go? It isn't a coincidence that basketball crazy schools like UK, Duke, UNC, Kansas, etc etc have kids who to go play there.

But also, it's not like he gets everyone he wants. Wiggins didn't go to Kentucky, nor did Parker, nor did Okafor, etc etc etc. If you look at last years recruiting class, Duke, Kansas, and UNC had just as many top tier recruits as Kentucky.

This post was edited on 3/23 10:50 PM by Cubs79
 
Originally posted by Cubs79:

Originally posted by SacreBleu:

Originally posted by Cubs79:
They are going to UK because it is a top tier basketball program and Cal has a history of putting kids into the NBA.
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This post was edited on 3/23 6:03 PM by Cubs79
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I think you got your cause and effect a little mixed up there. Cal gets FUTURE NBA PLAYERS to come to UK by playing footsie with the AAU scum. Tell me you've never heard of World Wide Wes.
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Those guys are all over the NCAA landscape, and as long they aren't paying players or things of that nature, it is perfectly legal.

* That's an extraordinary assumption on your part.

The fact of the matter, is that UK has probably the best facilities in the nation, is located in a great college town, has tradition that rivals any school in the nation, and currently has a coach who wins at the college level, has probably the largest basketball fan base in the country, and plays a system that highlights guys skill for the next level. Is it really hard to believe why kids want to go there?

* Explain the Tubby and Gillespie years to me then. (I know, but Mike Davis won a championship in year 1, too) Same town, facilities, tradition yada, yada. What they didn't have was players. Or the willingness to get their hands dirty. Was Memphis a storied program when Cal was there? Are you starting to see a pattern?

But also, it's not like he gets everyone he wants. Wiggins didn't go to Kentucky, nor did Parker, nor did Okafor, etc etc etc. If you look at last years recruiting class, Duke, Kansas, and UNC had just as many top tier recruits as Kentucky.

* LOL. UK took 3 and 4 players in the last two years. Because he didn't take ALL the AAs, it's all legit?
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Originally posted by SacreBleu:

Originally posted by Cubs79:

Originally posted by SacreBleu:

Originally posted by Cubs79:
They are going to UK because it is a top tier basketball program and Cal has a history of putting kids into the NBA.
Click to expand...
This post was edited on 3/23 6:03 PM by Cubs79
Click to expand...
I think you got your cause and effect a little mixed up there. Cal gets FUTURE NBA PLAYERS to come to UK by playing footsie with the AAU scum. Tell me you've never heard of World Wide Wes.
Click to expand...
Those guys are all over the NCAA landscape, and as long they aren't paying players or things of that nature, it is perfectly legal.

* That's an extraordinary assumption on your part.

The fact of the matter, is that UK has probably the best facilities in the nation, is located in a great college town, has tradition that rivals any school in the nation, and currently has a coach who wins at the college level, has probably the largest basketball fan base in the country, and plays a system that highlights guys skill for the next level. Is it really hard to believe why kids want to go there?

* Explain the Tubby and Gillespie years to me then. (I know, but Mike Davis won a championship in year 1, too) Same town, facilities, tradition yada, yada. What they didn't have was players. Or the willingness to get their hands dirty. Was Memphis a storied program when Cal was there? Are you starting to see a pattern?

But also, it's not like he gets everyone he wants. Wiggins didn't go to Kentucky, nor did Parker, nor did Okafor, etc etc etc. If you look at last years recruiting class, Duke, Kansas, and UNC had just as many top tier recruits as Kentucky.

* LOL. UK took 3 and 4 players in the last two years. Because he didn't take ALL the AAs, it's all legit?
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What is an extraordinary assumption on my part? You think Wes is the only guy with a relationship with AAU coaches and NCAA coaches? Seriously?
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/19800840/critical-coaches-how-deep-is-the-relationship-between-agents-and-aau-programs

There was also a big SI article several years ago about agents and their runners being all over campuses. The guy who wrote was a former NFL agent, so it was more with regards to football, but come on, there isn't a major program in the country (including yours), that doesn't have to deal with shady crap from agents and what not.

The Wes thing isn't new. If there were something illegal with it, don't you think it would have been found out by now? It seems to me the one making an assumption is you, not me. If it isn't legit, can you explain why? Can you explain what NCAA rule Cal has broken with regards to Wes? And if so, can you explain why other schools and coaches who deal with Wes haven't broken those rules. Again, you sure I am the one making the assumption?

Tubby won a national title and had a .760 winning % at Kentucky. I am not sure what you want me to explain with that. HIs style of play was a lot slower than Cal, which again goes to my point that Cal has an appealing style of play, especially for guys expecting to go to the next level quickly. Tubby did have some disappointing outs in the tournament, but he did reach the elite eight 4 times, and was seeded #1 or #2 several times.

Gillispie was simply a bad hire. Again, not sure what else you want me to say with that. A bad coach at a good program is still a bad coach. But, he was only their 2 years, so it's not like he was there long enough to make UK an irrelevant program, he was just more a speed bump.




This post was edited on 3/23 11:15 PM by Cubs79

This post was edited on 3/23 11:17 PM by Cubs79

This post was edited on 3/23 11:20 PM by Cubs79

This post was edited on 3/23 11:24 PM by Cubs79
 
I'll laugh at your obvious jealousy because it must suck to be a fan of a school that won't win a national championship in Basketball or Football in your lifetime.
 
What are you talking about? I'm just a fan, just like you. But, I don't bash programs because of jealousy. I actually think Huggins is a great coach that gets the most out of his players. I would never bring up the issues he had while he was at UC. What's that got to do with Thursday? This post is uniformed garbage. Read up on the Camby and Rose stuff to gain some knowledge before you post and sound like a wannabe. Have some pride!
 
yeah funny how he seems to coach at places that forfeit final 4 appearances

yet he did nothing to contribute.....read the stories about cal and how he covered his tracks and got other people to do his dirty work for him so he could claim innocence.....what number of calipari's did umass retire?.....if they did, so what?.....it didn't mean he didn't have complicity in what happened.....they named rupp arena after adolph rupp and he was plenty dirty and people knew it, so help me ralph beard and alex groza.....look those two names up in the uk pantheon.....look up chris mills.....look up eric manuel and eddie sutton and the kid who took his test for him.....look up how the lexington herald-leader got death threats for breaking open the story that put uk on major probation.....the paper won a pulitzer prize, but uk fans villified them as traitors.....and uk sure didn't seem to do any soul-searching about the program, except, it seems, to find someone like calipari with the apparent ability to cheat better, win and personally get away with it......the schools, however, have not been so lucky......

if you are trying to tell me calipari was completely hands clean on all that happened at umass and memphis, then you are swimming in that river called denial, imo.....just like uk fans that insist their beloved program is no dirtier than any other that, shall we say, has a history of cutting corners.....calipari apparently is good at covering his own tracks, but not so good at leaving the programs he has run without a lot of collateral damage, ie: forfeiting final 4s and leaving two programs with major ncaa sanctions while he runs off to the next gig.....the guy can coach, but he has an advantage in that he has no scruples.....none......note the guys at uk who didn't cheat -- gillespie, smith (when he had his own players, not ones left him by pitino), were not big-time winners.....

so it seems uk fans know uk can't win big without cheating and they want to win so bad they justify it and look the other way.....imo, this is as much on uk fans' tolerance of it as the coaches who have done it......

similar to some of the storied sec football schools.....

This post was edited on 3/24 2:43 AM by john in california
 
i'll clarify.....i was being snarky about what a dump lexington is......

it was sarcasm about how lexington is pretty much void of any real culture other than horse racing and a culture of obsession with uk basketball......
 
i'm not jealous of uk.....and i would never want wvu to be like uk.......

i note, however, that uk has a history of cheating scandals.....well-documented......they named the arena after the vile adolph rupp, the most scandal-plagued of all the uk coaches.....the fact you wave uk's titles tells me that, like most uk fans, you don't mind the legacy of misdeeds uk has left over the decades to get the titles.....jealousy, no.....dislike and disrespect for a program that has cheated for its success and its myopic fans that justify it?.....yes......

as for wvu, it at least has a well-above-average football program (much of the time).....uk is below average beyond basketball......
 
Re: yeah funny how he seems to coach at places that forfeit final 4 appearances

Originally posted by john in california:
yet he did nothing to contribute.....read the stories about cal and how he covered his tracks and got other people to do his dirty work for him so he could claim innocence.....what number of calipari's did umass retire?.....if they did, so what?.....it didn't mean he didn't have complicity in what happened.....they named rupp arena after adolph rupp and he was plenty dirty and people knew it, so help me ralph beard and alex groza.....look those two names up in the uk pantheon.....look up chris mills.....look up eric manuel and eddie sutton and the kid who took his test for him.....look up how the lexington herald-leader got death threats for breaking open the story that put uk on major probation.....the paper won a pulitzer prize, but uk fans villified them as traitors.....and uk sure didn't seem to do any soul-searching about the program, except, it seems, to find someone like calipari with the apparent ability to cheat better, win and personally get away with it......the schools, however, have not been so lucky......

if you are trying to tell me calipari was completely hands clean on all that happened at umass and memphis, then you are swimming in that river called denial, imo.....just like uk fans that insist their beloved program is no dirtier than any other that, shall we say, has a history of cutting corners.....calipari apparently is good at covering his own tracks, but not so good at leaving the programs he has run without a lot of collateral damage, ie: forfeiting final 4s and leaving two programs with major ncaa sanctions while he runs off to the next gig.....the guy can coach, but he has an advantage in that he has no scruples.....none......note the guys at uk who didn't cheat -- gillespie, smith (when he had his own players, not ones left him by pitino), were not big-time winners.....

so it seems uk fans know uk can't win big without cheating and they want to win so bad they justify it and look the other way.....imo, this is as much on uk fans' tolerance of it as the coaches who have done it......

similar to some of the storied sec football schools.....



This post was edited on 3/24 2:43 AM by john in california
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YOu are talking about things that happened over 25 years ago. No one denies UK has some incidents in it's past, but again, the last one was over a quarter of a century ago, and none of the people involved with it have anything to do with the school or program at this time. But, what about cleaning up your own back yard? WVU just got slapped for 2 years probation for recruiting violations in 14 different sports, which of course follows other violations committed by Rich Rod's program. Now, I am not saying that to crap on WVU, I think the NCAA is way over baring in a lot of ways, and a lot of these rules need to be scrapped. But, if UK is dirty because of what happened 26 years ago, then I think it is more than fair to point out that WVU has current issues, just to add some perspective.

This post was edited on 3/24 8:25 AM by Cubs79
 
John...., you seem so desperate. Hating on UK isn't going to add points on your teams scoreboard Thursday.
 
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