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Hoppy calls out

Marine03

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"The fiscal failure" which is everything to do on why I and many alike said Ollie screwed you.

Holgorsen’s hot seat
By Hoppy Kercheval in Hoppy's Commentary

December 07, 2015 at 12:38AM

If you listen closely, you will notice Mountaineers coach Dana Holgorsen has a penchant for honesty that sometimes evades head coaches. For many, generic comments, excuses or even outright hostility toward the media can be the norm.

When Holgorsen was asked the inevitable question following WVU’s crushing 24-23 loss at Kansas State Saturday about the critical failed fourth-and-1 attempt with 2:28 remaining, where a hobbled Skyler Howard stumbled and failed to get the first down, the coach was candid to the point of confessional.

“I wish we’d called something different,” Holgorsen said. “I thought we had the look. He had the edge, he just couldn’t get there. I should of took that into consideration,” said the coach, referring to Howard’s injured ankle.

The fact Holgorsen tends to own the Mountaineers’ on-field mistakes makes him a more sympathetic figure, and these days, the coach can use all the goodwill he can muster.

Based on the postgame phone calls, message board comments and general watercooler talk, much of Mountaineer Nation is frustrated with the fifth-year coach. But at least frustration carries with it some passion.

Worse yet is a growing indifference. Saturday’s abrupt interruption of a late-season winning streak will undoubtedly put a damper on fans’ postseason plans. It’s hard to imagine many of the Mountaineer faithful busting their holiday budgets for the flight and hotel in Phoenix to watch the Mountaineers in the Cactus Bowl.

But what to do?

It would be expensive to part ways with Holgorsen. The one-sided contract favoring the coach and negotiated—if that word can even apply in this instance—by former AD Oliver Luck calling for full payment for Holgorsen if he’s fired is a fiscal failure for the university. Can WVU really justify paying upwards of $9 million ($6 million to Holgorsen and another roughly $3 million to assistants) to break this deal?

The state of West Virginia is struggling financially now, and while the athletics department generates most of its own money, it still feels graceless to pay out millions to football coaches to not work.

Still, AD Shane Lyons, President Gordon Gee and Holgorsen have some decisions to make. If the university keeps the coach it will need to extend his contract, which is set to expire in two years (for recruiting purposes), but most certainly renegotiate the buyout to a more manageable number.

Lowering the buyout and restructuring the assistant coaches contracts is necessary but it will likely cause hard feelings. However, this is the university’s opportunity to fix the agreements when leverage is in its favor.

Given Holgorsen’s candor, even he must acknowledge this season and the program have not lived up to expectations he himself set. The coach’s honest evaluation of his own performance should make the inevitable decisions by Lyons and Gee that much easier.

Share this:
 
"The fiscal failure" which is everything to do on why I and many alike said Ollie screwed you.

Holgorsen’s hot seat
By Hoppy Kercheval in Hoppy's Commentary

December 07, 2015 at 12:38AM

If you listen closely, you will notice Mountaineers coach Dana Holgorsen has a penchant for honesty that sometimes evades head coaches. For many, generic comments, excuses or even outright hostility toward the media can be the norm.

When Holgorsen was asked the inevitable question following WVU’s crushing 24-23 loss at Kansas State Saturday about the critical failed fourth-and-1 attempt with 2:28 remaining, where a hobbled Skyler Howard stumbled and failed to get the first down, the coach was candid to the point of confessional.

“I wish we’d called something different,” Holgorsen said. “I thought we had the look. He had the edge, he just couldn’t get there. I should of took that into consideration,” said the coach, referring to Howard’s injured ankle.

The fact Holgorsen tends to own the Mountaineers’ on-field mistakes makes him a more sympathetic figure, and these days, the coach can use all the goodwill he can muster.

Based on the postgame phone calls, message board comments and general watercooler talk, much of Mountaineer Nation is frustrated with the fifth-year coach. But at least frustration carries with it some passion.

Worse yet is a growing indifference. Saturday’s abrupt interruption of a late-season winning streak will undoubtedly put a damper on fans’ postseason plans. It’s hard to imagine many of the Mountaineer faithful busting their holiday budgets for the flight and hotel in Phoenix to watch the Mountaineers in the Cactus Bowl.

But what to do?

It would be expensive to part ways with Holgorsen. The one-sided contract favoring the coach and negotiated—if that word can even apply in this instance—by former AD Oliver Luck calling for full payment for Holgorsen if he’s fired is a fiscal failure for the university. Can WVU really justify paying upwards of $9 million ($6 million to Holgorsen and another roughly $3 million to assistants) to break this deal?

The state of West Virginia is struggling financially now, and while the athletics department generates most of its own money, it still feels graceless to pay out millions to football coaches to not work.

Still, AD Shane Lyons, President Gordon Gee and Holgorsen have some decisions to make. If the university keeps the coach it will need to extend his contract, which is set to expire in two years (for recruiting purposes), but most certainly renegotiate the buyout to a more manageable number.

Lowering the buyout and restructuring the assistant coaches contracts is necessary but it will likely cause hard feelings. However, this is the university’s opportunity to fix the agreements when leverage is in its favor.

Given Holgorsen’s candor, even he must acknowledge this season and the program have not lived up to expectations he himself set. The coach’s honest evaluation of his own performance should make the inevitable decisions by Lyons and Gee that much easier.

Share this:

Interesting take:

"
The state of West Virginia is struggling financially now, and while the athletics department generates most of its own money, it still feels graceless to pay out millions to football coaches to not work.
"

Pretty baseless. The WVU athletic department is self sufficient, if we were to buy out Holgerson's contract there wouldn't be any money coming from state coffers to do it.

Marshall football, every single year though, that's a different story.
 
The state of West Virginia is struggling financially now, and while the athletics department generates most of its own money, it still feels graceless to pay out millions to football coaches to not work.

Most of its own money does not equate to self sufficient, nice try though
 
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So you discredit the $31,000? I guess if you cut off your pinky toe you still have all 10
 
So you discredit the $31,000? I guess if you cut off your pinky toe you still have all 10

$31k out of $77M? After a $4.2M profit .... yeah, that's self-sufficient.

That's 0.04% of the budget, or 0.0004. 4 ten-thousandths.

How else is there to put it? We don't need it, so therefore, yes, we are self-sufficient.

To put it in simpler terms, since you seem to be struggling ... If you make $50,000 and at the end of the year you still had $2000 in your saving's account, but somebody had given you $20, are you self-sufficient or not?
 
$31k out of $77M? After a $4.2M profit .... yeah, that's self-sufficient.

That's 0.04% of the budget, or 0.0004. 4 ten-thousandths.

How else is there to put it? We don't need it, so therefore, yes, we are self-sufficient.

To put it in simpler terms, since you seem to be struggling ... If you make $50,000 and at the end of the year you still had $2000 in your saving's account, but somebody had given you $20, are you self-sufficient or not?

Ok I'll give you the self supporting, however you're completely deflecting from the reason this entire article was posted. What are you going to do about Holgs? Are you going to let him continue to underachieve and take your program under or are you going to dip into the "self supporting" budget and buy him out?
 
Ok I'll give you the self supporting, however you're completely deflecting from the reason this entire article was posted. What are you going to do about Holgs? Are you going to let him continue to underachieve and take your program under or are you going to dip into the "self supporting" budget and buy him out?

That's not up to me.
Regardless of which route they go, we'll be fine. Hoppy is trying to make it out like we're stuck and we'd never be able to afford to buy him out. That's not the case at all. We've got enough BIG donors to cover that if they decide to go that route.

At this point I say to keep him. Has he underachieved? It's hard to say considering what he was left with and moving up in competition. We only now have had roughly the same staff on defense for 2 years in a row and they have played well, even with dealing with the injuries they've dealt with.

If Chugunov sucks, then I say get rid of him because he hasn't been able to recruit the kinds of QBs we need.

But replace him with who? Suddenly you have a whole new staff turnover to deal with which rarely comes out of the gate firing on all cylinders. Then you have to give that staff at least 3-4 years to get it done. So the question is, would we be better with Holgs gaining experience and having a stable staff for 3-4 years, or would we be better with a whole new staff in 3-4 years? There are often BIG issues with that. (example -- Charlie Strong and Texas)


And ... I wasn't deflecting from anything ... Hoppy's whole article was about the money involved in making a change and that's exactly what I addressed and countered an extremely flawed point he tried to make. The state's money woes won't be affected one way or the other by what we decide to do because we don't rely on any state money. I'm not sure where that $31k comes from, or more specifically why we get it, we don't need it. My guess would be that it comes from in-state athletes that qualified for the Promise Scholarship or something along those lines. I don't know, but it's such a small percentage as to be insignificant.

WVU's athletic program is NOT a burden on the state ... at all ... and any decision we make regarding a football coach won't change that.
 
Don't agree with all of his slants, but don't have a problem with Hoppy calling out Ollie. Ollie (with Clements playing a big role also), did a great job to get us in the Big XII. Most every over move, he World League'd though.
 
Click on the school name. It's a hyperlink to the detail.

OK, so the subsidy number in the main chart is the combination of Student Fees ($4M) and school funds($130k). The "student fees" certainly isn't coming from the taxpayer and the "school funds" doesn't match the $31k that was in Hoppy's article, so this chart only muddies the water even more.

So, again, I say self sufficient until somebody can prove me wrong.
 
The athletic program is not a state agency
Right - it's a for-profit commercial entity existing inside a state institution, whose genesis came without any intervention from state government or the school at large, and would continue to exist if both the state and school ceased to.

Now that we've cleared that up, we really need to get cracking on a loan repayment schedule so the state can recoup expenses.
 
Right - it's a for-profit commercial entity existing inside a state institution, whose genesis came without any intervention from state government or the school at large, and would continue to exist if both the state and school ceased to.

Now that we've cleared that up, we really need to get cracking on a loan repayment schedule so the state can recoup expenses.

If it's a state agency, then who in the government is in charge of it's oversight? Where is the line item in the budget to maintain it's funding.

Your statement is ridiculous.
 
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