I swear...once Wisky got a 9 point lead in the second half EVERY call went against them. Dukies were walking, throwing elbows, charging...All they had to do was sit at the foul line and shoot fouls...Wisky was the better team and should have won that game by 15 points. I think if a room full of officials watched the entire game with replays the majority would come away thinking that game was fixed. Three times I saw a Wisonsin player hit in the face with and elbow or poked in the eye and THEY ended up being called for the foul. NEVER have I seen a program that has gotten so many favorable calls over the years than Duke.
As you watched last night game did you get the feeling it was fixed?
- Thread starter MountainBill
- Start date
Nawh, I don't think the game last night was fixed...... but looking back on the tournament and just how things turned-out and considering how teams advanced through the brackets, Duke did have a much, shall I say easier, path than Wisconsin.
If I were to venture a guess on a single reason the Badgers lost that game it would be because to me they ran out of gas at the end....... the Dookies just appeared to have more energy and zip both offensively and defensively.
If I were to venture a guess on a single reason the Badgers lost that game it would be because to me they ran out of gas at the end....... the Dookies just appeared to have more energy and zip both offensively and defensively.
Nope. But it was poorly officiated at times.
Do you really think Wisconsin would buy into losing on purpose? They were playing WAY too hard for that.
Do you really think Wisconsin would buy into losing on purpose? They were playing WAY too hard for that.
The Badgers were physically done half way through 2nd half
The Kentucky game of two days prior, wore them out. They were ALL slow after around the 10:00 mark of the 2nd half. Dead legs and just looked exhausted. Duke took big-time advantage of that and won the game. The fouling part was mainly due to fatigue and half-assing on defense because of it.
The Kentucky game of two days prior, wore them out. They were ALL slow after around the 10:00 mark of the 2nd half. Dead legs and just looked exhausted. Duke took big-time advantage of that and won the game. The fouling part was mainly due to fatigue and half-assing on defense because of it.
Re: The Badgers were physically done half way through 2nd half
I did think there were some significant offensive fouls against Duke that should have been called that weren't. And the ball tipped out of bounds by Duke and given to Duke was an egregious call after the review.
But having said that ..... I think the biggest factor was that Wisconsin found it impossible to exert the supreme effort necessary to beat Duke just two days after their war with Kentucky. When, however, you're running out of gas and the calls seem to go against you it just saps whatever energy you might have left.
I did think there were some significant offensive fouls against Duke that should have been called that weren't. And the ball tipped out of bounds by Duke and given to Duke was an egregious call after the review.
But having said that ..... I think the biggest factor was that Wisconsin found it impossible to exert the supreme effort necessary to beat Duke just two days after their war with Kentucky. When, however, you're running out of gas and the calls seem to go against you it just saps whatever energy you might have left.
I think Duke won because their players played better, particularly the 2 freshmen guards, and Decker had one of the worst shooting nights of his career. Those 2 elements alone, I believe were enough for Duke to win.
I agree 100%. It seems that 70% of the posters on these boards do nothing but complain and come up with conspiracy theories. I watched a great basketball game last night that was taken over by a brilliant performance in the last 10mins or so by a by a freshman. I enjoyed the game even thought I was pulling for WI.
Re: The Badgers were physically done half way through 2nd half
..............a considerably easier path for the Dookies. The toll of the a more difficult path Wisconsin travelled showed-up, IMHO, and the Badgers appeared to simply run out of gas in the end.
Yep, the Wisconsin road went through Coastal Carolina, Oregon, North Carolina, Arizona, and Kentucky. While the Dookies' road went through Robert Morris, San Diego State, Utah, Gonzaga, and Michigan State.
..............a considerably easier path for the Dookies. The toll of the a more difficult path Wisconsin travelled showed-up, IMHO, and the Badgers appeared to simply run out of gas in the end.
It was all about...
Song Lyrics:
Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones
Got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-ooo
Yes, I am the victim of a Basketball Jones
Ever since I was a little baby, I always be dribblin'
In fac', I was de baddest dribbler in the whole neighborhood
Then one day, my mama bought me a basketball
And I loved that basketball
I took that basketball with me everywhere I went
That basketball was like a basketball to me
I even put that basketball underneath my pillow
Maybe that's why I can't sleep at night
I need help, ladies and gentlemens
I need someone to stand beside me
I need, I need someone to set a pick for me at the free-throw line of life
Someone I can pass to
Someone to hit the open man on the give-and-go
And not end up in the popcorn machine
So cheerleaders, help me out
{cheerleaders sing repeatedly...}
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones)
(I got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-ooo)
{while Tyrone Shoelaces sings/speaks...}
Oh, that sounds so sweet
Sing it out
C'mon Coach Booty, Red Blazer, sing along with me
That be bad, honky
Yeah
I want everybody in the whole stadium to stand up and sing with us
Oh yeah, sing it out like you're proud
All right, everybody watchin' coast-to-coast, sing along with us
Bill Russell, sing along with us
Chick Hearn, sing along with us
Chris Schenkel, don't sing nothin'
Oh, it feels so good
Gimme the ball
I'll go one-on-one against the world, left-handed
I could stuff it from center court with my toes
I could jump on top of the backboard, take off a quarter, leave fifteen cents change. I
could, I could dribble behind my back. I got more moves than Ex-Lax. I'm bad; I could
dribble with my tongue. Here I go down court, try to stop me You can't stop me, 'cause I
got a Basketball Jones. Here I come. That's my hook shot with my eyebrow. Yeah, I could
dunk it with my nose I'm, I'm bad as King Kong, gimme the ball I'm hot, I'm hot as...,
I'm hot as..., I'm hot as... uh Uh, uh, uh, uh
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
{fade}
Song Lyrics:
Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones
Got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-ooo
Yes, I am the victim of a Basketball Jones
Ever since I was a little baby, I always be dribblin'
In fac', I was de baddest dribbler in the whole neighborhood
Then one day, my mama bought me a basketball
And I loved that basketball
I took that basketball with me everywhere I went
That basketball was like a basketball to me
I even put that basketball underneath my pillow
Maybe that's why I can't sleep at night
I need help, ladies and gentlemens
I need someone to stand beside me
I need, I need someone to set a pick for me at the free-throw line of life
Someone I can pass to
Someone to hit the open man on the give-and-go
And not end up in the popcorn machine
So cheerleaders, help me out
{cheerleaders sing repeatedly...}
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones)
(I got a Basketball Jones, oh baby, oo-oo-ooo)
{while Tyrone Shoelaces sings/speaks...}
Oh, that sounds so sweet
Sing it out
C'mon Coach Booty, Red Blazer, sing along with me
That be bad, honky
Yeah
I want everybody in the whole stadium to stand up and sing with us
Oh yeah, sing it out like you're proud
All right, everybody watchin' coast-to-coast, sing along with us
Bill Russell, sing along with us
Chick Hearn, sing along with us
Chris Schenkel, don't sing nothin'
Oh, it feels so good
Gimme the ball
I'll go one-on-one against the world, left-handed
I could stuff it from center court with my toes
I could jump on top of the backboard, take off a quarter, leave fifteen cents change. I
could, I could dribble behind my back. I got more moves than Ex-Lax. I'm bad; I could
dribble with my tongue. Here I go down court, try to stop me You can't stop me, 'cause I
got a Basketball Jones. Here I come. That's my hook shot with my eyebrow. Yeah, I could
dunk it with my nose I'm, I'm bad as King Kong, gimme the ball I'm hot, I'm hot as...,
I'm hot as..., I'm hot as... uh Uh, uh, uh, uh
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
(Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, I got a Basketball Jones, Basketball Jones)
{fade}
The evidence was clear that duke touched the ball last before going out and it was reviewed. His finger bent backwards unnaturally on contact with the ball yet they still gave it to duke. Incredible incompetence or deliberate miss call? but in either case that was totally wrong.
And just because someone is paranoid does not mean that there are not people out to get them.
Most crimes are gotten away with, it is the repeat offender nature that gives the good guy any chance.
Ever hear of Tim Donaghy? .... the refs throwing games does go on and you almost certainly have watched it but simply did not know it was happening....How much does it happen is hard to say.
This post was edited on 4/7 4:58 PM by BombidEER
And just because someone is paranoid does not mean that there are not people out to get them.
Most crimes are gotten away with, it is the repeat offender nature that gives the good guy any chance.
Ever hear of Tim Donaghy? .... the refs throwing games does go on and you almost certainly have watched it but simply did not know it was happening....How much does it happen is hard to say.
This post was edited on 4/7 4:58 PM by BombidEER
Considering Wisconsin got the same "favorable" calls against Kentucky, I'd say they can't complain much. The officiating was awful from the sweet sixteen up to the final four. The fact that we are talking about how bad the refs were instead of how good the game was tells you all you need to know. They screw up calls, screw over teams, blow calls even after video reviews, and are not held accountable in any way. They do a pisspoor job because it gets them their fifteen minutes of fame on sports center the next day. And then make a buttload of money to do it again the next year. Why should they improve the quality of calls they make? They've got the sweetheart deal already!
You and I watched a different UK and Wisconsin game. The UK and Wisconsin game I watched had a UK player hit a Wisconsin player in the face, and by rule it is either a flagrant 1 or flagrant 2, yet after review there was no foul. The game I watched had a Wisconsin player driving for an inside shot and the UK player was running beside him and made contact and the call was charging against Wisconsin and that happened with about 2 minutes to go in the game.
In close games, one or two bad calls can be the difference in the game.
In close games, one or two bad calls can be the difference in the game.
No
I knew it was fixed before it even started. Great job by the Badgers. Thought they were going to win despite the overwhelming odds and being outnumbered.
I knew it was fixed before it even started. Great job by the Badgers. Thought they were going to win despite the overwhelming odds and being outnumbered.
In the Wisconsin-UK game you watched, you must have missed the blatant shot clock violation. Other than people who hate UK, everyone else saw Wiscy get the bulk of the calls. If te fix was in on the Duke-Wiscy game, no way Okafor was the only player in major foul trouble. That shoots the fix theory out of the water.
I'm not proclaiming whether it was bad referring or worse but if you learn anything from Tim Donaghy is that refs on the take go to great lengths to hide/obfuscate the fix including bad calls in favor of the team they are screwing. But only when it does not help them much to create the argument that the bad calls went both ways and thus it was just bad referring.
No what i am saying is that not all the complaints are bogus. Fixed games do happen. And since those were supposed to be good refs ...how was it that they botched one that was not a real time decision? was it that the refs were afraid to make a reverse call on a pampered duke program? There is no good reason for botching that one regardless of the source of error.
The point of a message board is to discuss the games, players, coaches and program. That would include the referring. As far as I'm concerned you are complaining about people posting relevant topics on this board. And I am not bitter about the game last night but referring is very much part of the game and there are issues in that area.
The point of a message board is to discuss the games, players, coaches and program. That would include the referring. As far as I'm concerned you are complaining about people posting relevant topics on this board. And I am not bitter about the game last night but referring is very much part of the game and there are issues in that area.
Nobody is saying you do not have the right to think stupid thoughts, draw stupid conclusions, say stupid things, or infringing in any way on your right to be stupid.
I don't think games are out and out fixed but I do think big name coaches such as Krzyzewski get preferential treatment, either consciously or unconsciously, from the officials. Krzyzewski basically said in his halftime interview that the foul situation would be different in the second half, and he was right. He is able to manipulate the officials.
Winslow was a key player for Duke and yet he had two blatant charges in the 2nd half that went uncalled, including one in which nobody was near either the charg-er or the charg-ee that couldn't have been more clear. I have a hard time believing it was a case of anything other than protecting the key Duke player, consciously or not, from getting an important foul because they've been being worked all game by the all-time winningest coach. I wish there was some way to play the game without the coaches being able interact with the officials and for officials to totally and completely call fouls as they do or don't see them without regard to who the team is or player is or game situation or how many fouls that guy has so far.
Winslow was a key player for Duke and yet he had two blatant charges in the 2nd half that went uncalled, including one in which nobody was near either the charg-er or the charg-ee that couldn't have been more clear. I have a hard time believing it was a case of anything other than protecting the key Duke player, consciously or not, from getting an important foul because they've been being worked all game by the all-time winningest coach. I wish there was some way to play the game without the coaches being able interact with the officials and for officials to totally and completely call fouls as they do or don't see them without regard to who the team is or player is or game situation or how many fouls that guy has so far.
The lucky shot plus 1 by Allen and the falling down 3 pointer
put the dagger in Wisconsin. I went to bed after those plays because I knew Duke would win. I think the fix is in anytime Duke plays to the extent that they get preferential treatment.
put the dagger in Wisconsin. I went to bed after those plays because I knew Duke would win. I think the fix is in anytime Duke plays to the extent that they get preferential treatment.
Re: The Badgers were physically done half way through 2nd half
Also, after Duke called the TO down 9, they changed defenses, maybe not right away but I did notice down the stretch them playing a much more aggressive extended defense where Wiscy's three point shooting was almost completely taken away and they didn't know how to handle it. It was like they didn't know what to do after that.
The thing that showed me the game was over was when Kaminsky, of all people, grabbed Okafor? when he was going in for a layup. He didn't even raise his arms or make any attempt to stop the shot. He just went for the player as if he just gave up on the play. I couldn't believe it and it was so uncharacteristic of them.
Fatigue had to be a big factor near the end because they had Okafor with four fouls and didn't seem to make an all out attempt at getting him out of there. Duke ramped it up and Wiscy just couldn't match them.
Also, after Duke called the TO down 9, they changed defenses, maybe not right away but I did notice down the stretch them playing a much more aggressive extended defense where Wiscy's three point shooting was almost completely taken away and they didn't know how to handle it. It was like they didn't know what to do after that.
The thing that showed me the game was over was when Kaminsky, of all people, grabbed Okafor? when he was going in for a layup. He didn't even raise his arms or make any attempt to stop the shot. He just went for the player as if he just gave up on the play. I couldn't believe it and it was so uncharacteristic of them.
Fatigue had to be a big factor near the end because they had Okafor with four fouls and didn't seem to make an all out attempt at getting him out of there. Duke ramped it up and Wiscy just couldn't match them.
NCAA HEAD OFFICIAL SAYS, "We never saw what everybody saw at home....... "
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/ncaa-head-of-officials-on-controversial-play---we-never-saw-what-everybody-saw-at-home-213242341.html
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/ncaa-head-of-officials-on-controversial-play---we-never-saw-what-everybody-saw-at-home-213242341.html
You say I'm "the type of person who should not be allowed to post", even when I've demonstrated "substance and brains" (a.k.a. intelligence) in response to your unsubstantiated claims and demonstrated stupidity.Originally posted by BombidEER:
And you are exactly the type of person who should not be allowed to post.Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
My ad homin reply was earned, accurate, and justified.
This post was edited on 4/8 10:34 AM by BombidEER
How'd you like what the Head NCAA Official had to say in light of your claims implying the game was 'thrown' or fixed' with you statements, "refs throwing games does go on" and "fixed games do happen"?
You still gonna' run around making claims the game was "thrown" or "fixed"?
When I first started posting here about a year and a half ago, I thought "what is this guy's problem?" I quit posting here for a while and then came back and noticed he's an ass to just about everyone.
He's another 18 year old in his mom's basement.
He's another 18 year old in his mom's basement.
You have never demonstrated brains substance, or intelligence. For starters, I never said it was thrown or fixed. I said games do get fixed (ala Tim Donaghy) and since they can be hard to tell (Tim did it for years and was very slick about it), I don't have problems with people raising questions. That is a good thing. I also pointed out there was some very obvious bad calls in that game for whatever reason and that could lead to speculation. And that this forum is to discuss such things and complaining about the discussion makes no sense ala AZeer as I see it. That was my point if you followed this paragraph (unlikely)Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
You say I'm "the type of person who should not be allowed to post", even when I've demonstrated "substance and brains" (a.k.a. intelligence) in response to your unsubstantiated claims and demonstrated stupidity.Originally posted by BombidEER:
And you are exactly the type of person who should not be allowed to post.Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
My ad homin reply was earned, accurate, and justified.
This post was edited on 4/8 10:34 AM by BombidEER
How'd you like what the Head NCAA Official had to say in light of your claims implying the game was 'thrown' or fixed' with you statements, "refs throwing games does go on" and "fixed games do happen"?
You still gonna' run around making claims the game was "thrown" or "fixed"?
You have no comprehension skills (or ability to seperate different posters comments). You have owned no one and you could not own a sack of jelly beans let alone another person. You are just an ignorant trouble making troll with too much hubris.
This post was edited on 4/8 4:25 PM by BombidEER
This post was edited on 4/8 7:59 PM by BombidEER
Listen-up, Shit-For-Brains........ let me explain this to you like the F'N idiot you've proven yourself to be.Originally posted by BombidEER:
You have never demonstrated brains substance, or intelligence. For starters, I never said it was thrown or fixed. I said games do get fixed (ala Tim Donaghy) and since they can be hard to tell (Tim did it for years and was very slick about it), I don't have problems with people raising questions. That is a good thing. I also pointed out there was some very obvious bad calls in that game for whatever reason and that could lead to speculation. And that this forum is to discuss such things and complaining about the discussion makes no sense ala AZeer as I see it. That was my point if you followed this paragraph (unlikely)Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
You say I'm "the type of person who should not be allowed to post", even when I've demonstrated "substance and brains" (a.k.a. intelligence) in response to your unsubstantiated claims and demonstrated stupidity.Originally posted by BombidEER:
And you are exactly the type of person who should not be allowed to post.Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
My ad homin reply was earned, accurate, and justified.
This post was edited on 4/8 10:34 AM by BombidEER
How'd you like what the Head NCAA Official had to say in light of your claims implying the game was 'thrown' or fixed' with you statements, "refs throwing games does go on" and "fixed games do happen"?
You still gonna' run around making claims the game was "thrown" or "fixed"?
You have no comprehension skills (or ability to seperate different posters comments). You have owned no one and you could not own a sack of jelly beans let alone another person. You are just an ignorant trouble making troll with to much hubris.
This post was edited on 4/8 4:25 PM by BombidEER
The official was not shown the replay video, as the viewers of the game were, that showed the Duke player as last to touch the ball before it went out of bounds. The official was shown a different video that did not reflect 'undisputable video evidence' that the Duke player was last to touch the ball.... therefore if the official had made the call without the 'undisputable video evidence' the game would have indeed been corrupted. Surly, after having it explained to you you'd understand that, but as evidenced, it's doubtful, not probably, and very unlikely.
The official made the right call according to the rules of the game, IDIOT.
Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
Listen-up, Shit-For-Brains........ let me explain this to you like the F'N idiot you've proven yourself to be.Originally posted by BombidEER:
You have never demonstrated brains substance, or intelligence. For starters, I never said it was thrown or fixed. I said games do get fixed (ala Tim Donaghy) and since they can be hard to tell (Tim did it for years and was very slick about it), I don't have problems with people raising questions. That is a good thing. I also pointed out there was some very obvious bad calls in that game for whatever reason and that could lead to speculation. And that this forum is to discuss such things and complaining about the discussion makes no sense ala AZeer as I see it. That was my point if you followed this paragraph (unlikely)Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
You say I'm "the type of person who should not be allowed to post", even when I've demonstrated "substance and brains" (a.k.a. intelligence) in response to your unsubstantiated claims and demonstrated stupidity.Originally posted by BombidEER:
And you are exactly the type of person who should not be allowed to post.Originally posted by PaintedontheSky:
My ad homin reply was earned, accurate, and justified.
This post was edited on 4/8 10:34 AM by BombidEER
How'd you like what the Head NCAA Official had to say in light of your claims implying the game was 'thrown' or fixed' with you statements, "refs throwing games does go on" and "fixed games do happen"?
You still gonna' run around making claims the game was "thrown" or "fixed"?
You have no comprehension skills (or ability to seperate different posters comments). You have owned no one and you could not own a sack of jelly beans let alone another person. You are just an ignorant trouble making troll with to much hubris.
This post was edited on 4/8 4:25 PM by BombidEER
The official was not shown the replay video, as the viewers of the game were, that showed the Duke player as last to touch the ball before it went out of bounds. The official was shown a different video that did not reflect 'undisputable video evidence' that the Duke player was last to touch the ball.... therefore if the official had made the call without the 'undisputable video evidence' the game would have indeed been corrupted. Surly, after having it explained to you you'd understand that, but as evidenced, it's doubtful, not probably, and very unlikely.
The official made the right call according to the rules of the game, IDIOT.
More derogatory posts from the mental midget troll. The only one proving himself and idiot is you. You are the one who can't follow a conversation and make false assertions about what the poster said even though it is clear as day.
And you continue to fail on comprehension,.I never took a definitive position on whether the refs deliberately got the calls wrong or whether their was favoritism or a fixed game or just honest mistakes. I did say that discussing the job the refs did was fair game for forum discussion despite others who want to attack those who do what to discuss it.
This latest response from you is a diversion on a topic irrelevant to my points in an attempt for you to think you are making yourself look smart when it just makes you even dumber. So, lets go down this side track. The fact is the game had some really bad calls mostly in favor of Duke in which the best crews should be officiating and not making these mistakes. It is clear that the refs were getting a lot of well deserved heat so the head of officiating comes forth with excuses (the dog ate my homework) rather than apologize and a pledge to do better in the future. It is their job to get it right. And as far as getting contentious over this proves nothing about the original conversation. Counter points:
1) no independent validation that they did not get the same views and they have motive to be less than honest.
2) The very wording implies they did get the angles but just not a digital zoom. Well, I saw the finger bend before they did a digital zoom and it is there job to get it right.
3) Your conclusion again shows you for the moronic idiot that you are. The correct ruling by the rules would have been Wisconsin's ball with a review that affirmed it. What they did do properly was follow a consistent procedure for a question call that they ultimately egregiously got wrong. Only a mental midget like you ( or a completely disingenuous hack) would think it was the right call.
And this is just a diversion from you embarrassing stupidity of being unable to follow a conversation or offer an apology for being wrong and an obnoxious troll!
