1988 fans and critics wondered how the traditional conferences would deal with Independents.

[WVUALLEN]

Would WVU have won the title had they beaten Notre Dame?

There were some in 1988 claiming they would vote for Miami Fla., if they beat Nebraska and if WVU had won over Notre Dame so possibly could have been split champions. But WVU and Notre Dame were the only 2 unbeaten teams. Miami one loss came at the hands of ND.

End of Season Rankings
#1 Notre Dame 11-0
#2 Miami, Fla. 10-1
#3 WVU 11-0
#4 Florida State 11-1

Final Ranking
#1 ND
#2 Miami, Fla.
#3 FSU
#4 Michigan
#5 WVU

Final rankings after the bowls WVU finished 5th as Michigan jumped from 11th to #4 with Rose Bowl win. Those January bowl winners majority of the time finished 1 through 4. So you can see why many may have chosen Miami instead of WVU as Miami was #2. But WVU playing #1 Notre Dame was key in that voting process.

1988 became a focus for fans and critics who wondered how the traditional conferences would deal with the indies (the answer ultimately involved all of these teams joining major conferences). Exception ND. They joined a major conference for everything but Football.

 

[SeronimusPratt]

I REALLY think it would hard to argue against WVU being the national champs had they beat the golden domers.

Back then, they didn't have computers making the choices. SO I think the human element would be more present in that decision making.

 

[MichiganHerd]

Ironically, Michigan started out the year in 1988, losing at Notre Dame 19-17, and losing at home to Miami 31-30, before winning the final 10 games.

 

[Euell]

Would WVU have won the title had they beaten Notre Dame?

There were some in 1988 claiming they would vote for Miami Fla., if they beat Nebraska and if WVU had won over Notre Dame so possibly could have been split champions. But WVU and Notre Dame were the only 2 unbeaten teams. Miami one loss came at the hands of ND.

End of Season Rankings
#1 Notre Dame 11-0
#2 Miami, Fla. 10-1
#3 WVU 11-0
#4 Florida State 11-1

Final Ranking
#1 ND
#2 Miami, Fla.
#3 FSU
#4 Michigan
#5 WVU

Final rankings after the bowls WVU finished 5th as Michigan jumped from 11th to #4 with Rose Bowl win. Those January bowl winners majority of the time finished 1 through 4. So you can see why many may have chosen Miami instead of WVU as Miami was #2. But WVU playing #1 Notre Dame was key in that voting process.

1988 became a focus for fans and critics who wondered how the traditional conferences would deal with the indies (the answer ultimately involved all of these teams joining major conferences). Exception ND. They joined a major conference for everything but Football.

I think definitely WVU would have been national champs had they beaten ND. I was at that game and have never witnessed that much electricity in the air at a game before or since, although some have come close ('93 WVU-Miami game comes to mind.)

 

[WVUALLEN]

I think definitely WVU would have been national champs had they beaten ND. I was at that game and have never witnessed that much electricity in the air at a game before or since, although some have come close ('93 WVU-Miami game comes to mind.)

Sugar Bowl in Georgia was pretty close to that. Playing Georgia in their backyard was pretty intimidating.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Sugar Bowl in Georgia was pretty close to that. Playing Georgia in their backyard was pretty intimidating.

LSU's*

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Are you asking would independents still be given the respect with the CFP?

Matters what year you started the CFP.

That changes a lot of things.
But if you started that year I am pretty sure that ND, Miami and Penn State would be highly respected

WVU played Penn State. Don't think it was a great team for them.

There is a chance they could have been left out like a UCF

BYU supposedly won a legit AP NC in that ers

 

[WVUALLEN]

LSU's*

LSU had a Hurricane and Sugar Bowl was moved for 2006 to Atlanta. If you're going to be a troll at least know what you're talking about.

 

[WVUALLEN]

Are you asking would independents still be given the respect with the CFP?

Matters what year you started the CFP.

That changes a lot of things.
But if you started that year I am pretty sure that ND, Miami and Penn State would be highly respected

WVU played Penn State. Don't think it was a great team for them.

There is a chance they could have been left out like a UCF

BYU supposedly won a legit AP NC in that ers

Didn't ask that. That's your troll projection. Just commenting on the past if WVU would have been given the votes if they had beaten ND. Then you can look at the rankings and see it was dominated by Independents.

Conferences started grabbing them up like hot cakes. Starting with PSU to Big 10. Big East basketball was king at the time and didn't want to lose their teams to another conference. Thus began the Big East football which they thought would make them happy but then they never ran it like they should have. Big East Football was an after thought now the majority are in ACC.

 

[WVUALLEN]

Ironically, Michigan started out the year in 1988, losing at Notre Dame 19-17, and losing at home to Miami 31-30, before winning the final 10 games.

They tied with Iowa Oct 14th, 1988 by the score of 17-17. They beat #5 USC in the Rose Bowl 22-14.

Date	Time	Opponent	Rank	Site	TV	Result	Attendance
September 10	9:00 p.m.	at No. 13 Notre Dame*	No. 9	Notre Dame Stadium Notre Dame, IN (rivalry)	CBS	L 17–19	59,075
September 17	3:30 p.m.	No. 1 Miami (FL)*	No. 15	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI	ABC	L 30–31	105,834
September 24	1:00 p.m.	Wake Forest*	No. 19	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI	W 19–9	102,776
October 1	2:00 p.m.	at Wisconsin	No. 19	Camp Randall Stadium Madison, WI	W 62–14	61,180
October 8	12:00 p.m.	Michigan State	No. 17	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI (Paul Bunyan Trophy)	Big 10 Synd.	W 17–3	106,208
October 15	3:30 p.m.	at Iowa	No. 15	Kinnick Stadium Iowa City, IA	ABC	T 17–17	67,700
October 22	3:30 p.m.	No. 14 Indiana	No. 20	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI	ABC	W 31–6	106,104
October 29	2:00 p.m.	at Northwestern	No. 14	Dyche Stadium Evanston, IL	W 52–7	33,647
November 5	3:30 p.m.	Minnesota	No. 14	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI (Little Brown Jug)	ABC	W 22–7	102,171
November 12	1:00 p.m.	Illinois	No. 13	Michigan Stadium Ann Arbor, MI	W 38–9	105,714
November 19	12:00 p.m.	at Ohio State	No. 12	Ohio Stadium Columbus, OH (The Game)	ABC	W 34–31	90,176
January 1, 1989	5:00 p.m.	vs. No. 5 USC*	No. 11	Rose Bowl Pasadena, CA (Rose Bowl)	ABC	W 22–14	101,688

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Didn't ask that. That's your troll projection. Just commenting on the past if WVU would have been given the votes if they had beaten ND. Then you can look at the rankings and see it was dominated by Independents.

Conferences started grabbing them up like hot cakes. Starting with PSU to Big 10. Big East basketball was king at the time and didn't want to lose their teams to another conference. Thus began the Big East football which they thought would make them happy but then they never ran it like they should have. Big East Football was an after thought now the majority are in ACC.

Big East Football was ran correctly.

Just didn't meet the expectations viewer wise.

CBS actually had a contract with both the SEC and Big East.
Put the games on at the same time in different parts of the country.

What ended up happening was that the Big East wasn't bringing in the viewers so the SEC was taking up most the TV affiliates.
Until CBS ended the contract with the Big East.

You can say it was stupid to put it up against the SEC in the mid 90's...

Big East did a great job later at taking over the games during the week.
A lot of people remember great Big East Football on Thursday night.

 

[WVUALLEN]

Big East Football was ran correctly.

Just didn't meet the expectations viewer wise.

CBS actually had a contract with both the SEC and Big East.
Put the games on at the same time in different parts of the country.

What ended up happening was that the Big East wasn't bringing in the viewers so the SEC was taking up most the TV affiliates.
Until CBS ended the contract with the Big East.

You can say it was stupid to put it up against the SEC in the mid 90's...

Big East did a great job later at taking over the games during the week.
A lot of people remember great Big East Football on Thursday night.

No it wasn't. The leaders of Big East were more concerned with basketball than football. If they hadn't have been it would have thrived.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

No it wasn't. The leaders of Big East were more concerned with basketball than football. If they hadn't have been it would have thrived.

Are you speaking about not including Penn State.

Point is that the Big East was given the spots. People didn't watch the games...

Maybe if Penn State was there things would be different
But the conference can't create viewers .
People have to choose to watch themselves

 

[WVUALLEN]

Are you speaking about not including Penn State.

That would have helped but PSU was not invited to the basketball conference. Huge mistake in 1984. Had they been thinking football and not basketball only then it may have been the ACC doing damage control.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

That would have helped but PSU was not invited to the basketball conference. Huge mistake in 1984. Had they been thinking football and not basketball only then it may have been the ACC doing damage control.

Problem with the Big East

Like I continue to tell people is that the Northeast may have a lot of people but those people don't watch college football.

Wasn't anything the Big East did. It was what people didn't do that weren't connected to the conference.

They much rather wait for the Giants, Jets or Patriots to play on Sunday than waste a Saturday watching Syracuse vs Boston College

 

[WVUALLEN]

Problem with the Big East

Like I continue to tell people is that the Northeast may have a lot of people but those people don't watch college football.

Wasn't anything the Big East did. It was what people didn't do that weren't connected to the conference.

They much rather wait for the Giants, Jets or Patriots to play on Sunday than waste a Saturday watching Syracuse vs Boston College

Big East Commissioners failed football. Basketball only teams were afraid of schools that played both sports in D1. Football began in 1991 with Miami being the only team entering to be allowed full access to all sports. WVU, Rutgers were offered in all sports 95 and 96 as well as Notre Dame but they remained football independent. Va.Tech would have to wait until 2000-2001 for full admission.

The unusual structure of the Big East, with the football and non-football schools, led to instability in the conference. In 2003, the ongoing press reports of tensions between the football schools and the basketball-only schools.

The end result was that three Big East schools Virginia Tech, Miami and Boston College moved to the ACC. What people didn't know at the time was ACC only wanted Syracuse and BC. But SU balked at the idea so they asked Miami. Then VT cried to the governor of Virginia to force UVA to get them in.

Then you replace them with Louisville, Cincinnati, South Florida and FCS UCONN to the football side. With talks of getting Villanova a D2 football school added as well. Marquette and Depaul entered in BB only and CUSA became a slaughtered pig.

Because of a basketball first conference led by former Basketball coaches as commisioners the Big East football failed and paid the price. Poor leadership from the top from the start.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Big East Commissioners failed football. Basketball only teams were afraid of schools that played both sports in D1. Football began in 1991 with Miami being the only team entering to be allowed full access to all sports. WVU, Rutgers were offered in all sports 95 and 96 as well as Notre Dame but they remained football independent. Va.Tech would have to wait until 2000-2001 for full admission.

The unusual structure of the Big East, with the football and non-football schools, led to instability in the conference. In 2003, the ongoing press reports of tensions between the football schools and the basketball-only schools.

The end result was that three Big East schools Virginia Tech, Miami and Boston College moved to the ACC. What people didn't know at the time was ACC only wanted Syracuse and BC. But SU balked at the idea so they asked Miami. Then VT cried to the governor of Virginia to force UVA to get them in.

Then you replace them with Louisville, Cincinnati, South Florida and FCS UCONN to the football side. With talks of getting Villanova a D2 football school added as well. Marquette and Depaul entered in BB only and CUSA became a slaughtered pig.

Because of a basketball first conference led by former Basketball coaches as commisioners the Big East football failed and paid the price. Poor leadership from the top from the start.

That wouldn't have created TV ratings.

The failure was based on not having an auidence
There was an auidence for Big East Basketball but not for football .

 

[TownesVanZandt]

This is just hardcore facts here about football.

Penn State and ND are the only two teams that matter in the Northeast

Both the Big East and ACC failed by not bringing in Penn State

They also failed by attaching themselves to ND. A school who most likely won't join as a full time member

Even as a member of the conference they aren't taking advantage of ND in football
ND baseball and basketball are important but it isn't ND Football.

People won't watch Boston College vs Syracuse.
They will watch Penn State vs Syracuse or Penn State vs Boston College.

Only two teams that can compete with the NFL.
Penn State has a bigger stadium than both the Eagles and Steelers

 

[WVUALLEN]

That wouldn't have created TV ratings.

The failure was based on not having an auidence
There was an auidence for Big East Basketball but not for football .

You're brain dead. Go troll some other thread and change it to something other than the topic.

 

[WVUALLEN]

This is just hardcore facts here about football.

Penn State and ND are the only two teams that matter in the Northeast

Both the Big East and ACC failed by not bringing in Penn State

They also failed by attaching themselves to ND. A school who most likely won't join as a full time member

Even as a member of the conference they aren't taking advantage of ND in football
ND baseball and basketball are important but it isn't ND Football.

People won't watch Boston College vs Syracuse.
They will watch Penn State vs Syracuse or Penn State vs Boston College.

Only two teams that can compete with the NFL.
Penn State has a bigger stadium than both the Eagles and Steelers

Doesn't know the history or the story. Move on fool.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

If you cannot admit that the Big East failed because it lacked attention...

Don't know what to tell you ..

There wasn't a team who could bring eyeballs to the television in the Northeast

Philly, NY and Boston have 40 million people in them and between them..

But they watch the NFL

 

[WVUALLEN]

It lacked attention because of the commissioners that ran it cared more about basketball.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

It lacked attention because of the commissioners that ran it cared more about basketball.

Because basketball had the attention.

Miami only had one big game all season and that was against Florida State for the most part.
VA Tech improved over this time
Syracuse had some decent teams going into the late 1990s

Overall the conference lacked a football school to stir the drink

That would have been Penn State


In the Northeast...
Syracuse is probably the most important basketball school
Penn State is the most important football school

You can see this by attendance.
Big East BBall had Syracuse
Big East Football didn't have Penn State


Don't think the Big East schools wanted to give Penn State that stage in BBall

So you could be correct...
That Basketball was more important than Football

But incorrect about the attention.
Attention is what caused the conference to value one sport over the other



College Football is always localized...

Hard to get people to pay attention elsewhere when people locally don't care.

In the Big East people cared about the NFL

 

[WVUALLEN]

Snore. Come up with something tangible or stay off this thread.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

You know I am right.

But in the end I believe everyone was screwed
Even Penn State, Rutgers and you can throw Maryland in there

 

[WVUFanForever]

To answer a previous question here...if WVU beats Notre Dame, they would have have been voted as national champions no questions asked.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

To answer a previous question here...if WVU beats Notre Dame, they would have have been voted as national champions no questions asked.

Who else would have been?

 

[WVUFanForever]

Who else would have been?

Allen was theorizing in the original post it could have been Miami.

 

[TownesVanZandt]

Allen was theorizing in the original post it could have been Miami.

Miami shouldn't even won their first NC.
Florida kicked the living shit out of them.

Best 4 teams were Texas, Auburn, Georgia and Florida.

Sometimes the NC didn't go to the best team.
Miami was maybe the best team at the end of the year but they lost to ND.
WVU beats ND they win a NC

Pretty cut and dry

Sometimes what helps you screws you another time
What helped Miami was playing the supposed #1 team Nebraska
Nebraska wasn't that elite in the 80's.
Those 4 earlier teams I mentioned would have ran then off the field

 

[WVUALLEN]

The way the AP votes it could have been split easily. AP voted and given five AP national championships (1983, 1987, 1989, 1991, 2001) to Miami. Very likely the give them another with coaches voting for WVU. AP voting is always suspect.

I don't like them either but it's apparent the AP did.

Florida was the first game of the season in 1983.

1983 Texas lost Georgia, Auburn lost to Texas, Georgia tied Clemson lost to Auburn, Florida tied USC and lost to Georgia, Auburn. Miami deserved it as much as those 4. The coaches poll also voted Miami #1